My Very Own Sub-Forum on CODOH!

[Stubble]

Stubble, I just noticed your mention of 88,000 at Treblinka. Which reports/studies/excavations are you basing this on? I have found nothing suggesting figures even into the thousands there. I may have missed something, let me know.

Theoretical maximum with entirely unreasonable packing density (7-8/m^3) of the 4 'Huge Mass Graves' indicated by the multi party contemporary maps that line up with GPR returns for g51, g52, g53 and g54.

I also maximized the grave space and assumed a 7m depth as well as 0 sand and 0 top fill.

I was being as forgiving as possible.

[Keen]

I would concede a maximum of some ~40-50,000 at Sobibor

50,000 divided by 22 = 2,273.

Callafangers, please tell us how many have been proven to exist in each one of Soibors 22 alleged "huge mass graves"

https://codohforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=16876#p16876

Maybe the remaining 49,989 jews are all buried in the "well grave"?

You can prove that the "well grave" actually exists, can't you Callafangers?

And let's not forget what that low IQ freak Roberta Muehlenkamp said:

nos. 9, 10 and 11 are very small and therefore shouldn't be called "huge mass graves" but merely "graves"

[Callafangers]

The standard applied in U.S civil courts is the very low preponderance of evidence standard.



Callafangers,

Of the 33 alleged Belzec graves / cremation pits in question - the one that you can conclusively prove currently contains the most human remains is number: _?_.

Of the 21 alleged Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question - the one that you can conclusively prove currently contains the most human remains is number: _?_.

Of the 22 alleged Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question - the one that you can conclusively prove currently contains the most human remains is number: _?_.

Of the 15 alleged Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question - the one that you can conclusively prove currently contains the most human remains is number: _?_.

Of the 91 alleged graves / cremation pits of Belzec, Chelmno, Sobibor and Treblinka II in question - the one that you can conclusively prove currently contains the most human remains is number: _?_.

What are you waiting for Callafangers?

Keen, this above is the exact kind of unproductive shenanigans that you've been called out on. It was just explained to you that, while your questions are valuable, they don't require you to defend any specific point or conclusion. Your questions are strong, therefore, but your argument is weak, since you are not actually arguing anything but simply spamming your questions.

I repeat: they are good questions. But notice that all of your questions are qualitative in nature -- they all use the word "conclusively", which is a standard that has no universal definition, thus it becomes a matter of opinion; not fact, not measurable, not verifiable... so, it cannot ever explain what did or did not happen.

Regarding the "standard applied in US civil courts", aka "preponderance of evidence", it is defined as:

preponderance /prĭ-pŏn′dər-əns/
noun
1. Superiority in weight, force, importance, or influence.

In other words, it just has to be more likely than not that the evidence shows a certain number of corpses at a given location. But who is the arbiter of how and whether this standard is met? You and I are not US courts, we are not at trial, and so it is really just conflicting opinions about whether the studies by the likes of Kola, Lukaszkiewicz, etc. are actually truthful, accurate, and/or meaningful to any degree.

[Keen]

Bla, bla, bla...

Callafangers,

List all of the Belzec graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

Oh, and don't forget about this:

https://codohforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=18614#p18614

[Callafangers]

Theoretical maximum with entirely unreasonable packing density (7-8/m^3) of the 4 'Huge Mass Graves' indicated by the multi party contemporary maps that line up with GPR returns for g51, g52, g53 and g54.

I also maximized the grave space and assumed a 7m depth as well as 0 sand and 0 top fill.

I was being as forgiving as possible.

Ah, got it. I give zero credit to any "ground disturbance" findings. Judge Łukaszkiewicz's Treblinka reports (and similar reports at Belzec/Sobibor) have shown conclusively that discarded [Jewish] property burials were far more common than corpse burials were. Therefore, any 'disturbances' are far more likely to contain trash than anything else. At Treblinka, specifically, of "innumerable" craters/holes there, and countless instances of unearthing clothing, rags, furniture, coins, kitchenware, etc., there was only a single crater with any evidence of corpse remains. Overall, 'disturbances' reflect more buried garbage (or past diggings, bombings), until proven otherwise.

[Keen]

Your questions are strong, therefore, but your argument is weak, since you are not actually arguing anything but simply spamming your questions.

I'm not arguing, you are under cross examination and you are failing miserably.

You dodge questions then pretend that I am spamming.

You are acting EXACTLY like Nessie and the other lying HC cowards.

[Stubble]

I'm willing to grant and maximize g51, g52, g53 and g54 and still tell exterminationists that it amounts to a thimble.

The reason for this is the contemporary multi witness maps that line up with the GPR returns.

The only compelling evidence for any mass graves at that site are those listed.

The rest, well, if you are finding spoons and busted picture frames, I don't think that's a 'Huge Mass Grave' regardless of what CSC would have you believe, you know?

But even entertaining this is generous and should be remarked upon as such, because exactly 0 prove up has been done.

[Callafangers]

Bla, bla, bla...

Callafangers,

List all of the Belzec graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

We had a whole thread discussing one of these recently, Keen. See the one on "Olympic swimming pools", where I wrote at-length about a specific crater (25m diameter, 6m depth) reportedly containing enough corpse remains to be scattered in significant quantities (enough to cause nauseating odor from >100m away) across a 2 hectares area. The nature of the excavation, size/scope of the crater and scattering, and the language in the report overall strongly suggests corpses numbering at least in the dozens but likely into the low-mid hundreds.

At Belzec/Sobibor, we have core samples in many instances (taken in a grid 5m apart across a larger area, and samples often containing verified corpse material) that can be extrapolated somewhat to give meaningful insights. This has been overstretched by exterminationists, of course, and even the most charitable interpretations only allow for some low tens of thousands of corpses there. Nonetheless, these excavations appear to have been conducted by parties whom, thus far, could be interpreted as sufficiently credentialed (even if not entirely impartial). Questions remain but these findings should be taken into account.

[Callafangers]

I'm willing to grant and maximize g51, g52, g53 and g54 and still tell exterminationists that it amounts to a thimble.

The reason for this is the contemporary multi witness maps that line up with the GPR returns.

Are the 'witnesses' not shown as likely to claim any garbage pit was actually a corpse pit?

[Keen]

notice that all of your questions are qualitative in nature -- they all use the word "conclusively", which is a standard that has no universal definition, thus it becomes a matter of opinion; not fact, not measurable, not verifiable... so, it cannot ever explain what did or did not happen.

This is bullshit magical thinking that you are hiding behind.

Can you conclusive prove to yourself that you have a dick?

[Keen]

Bla, bla, bla...

Callafangers,

List all of the Belzec graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

We had a whole thread discussing one of these recently, Keen. See the one on "Olympic swimming pools", where I wrote at-length about a specific crater (25m diameter, 6m depth) reportedly containing enough corpse remains to be scattered in significant quantities (enough to cause nauseating odor from >100m away) across a 2 hectares area. The nature of the excavation, size/scope of the crater and scattering, and the language in the report overall strongly suggests corpses numbering at least in the dozens but likely into the low-mid hundreds.

At Belzec/Sobibor, we have core samples in many instances (taken in a grid 5m apart across a larger area, and samples often containing verified corpse material) that can be extrapolated somewhat to give meaningful insights. This has been overstretched by exterminationists, of course, and even the most charitable interpretations only allow for some low tens of thousands of corpses there. Nonetheless, these excavations appear to have been conducted by parties whom, thus far, could be interpreted as sufficiently credentialed (even if not entirely impartial). Questions remain but these findings should be taken into account.

Look at Nessie, err, I mean, look at Callafangers run!

No wonder he's opposed to a cross examination thread!



Callafangers,

List all of the Belzec graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

[Keen]

And Callafangers is running away from this too:

I would concede a maximum of some ~40-50,000 at Sobibor

50,000 divided by 22 = 2,273.

Callafangers, please tell us how many have been proven to exist in each one of Soibors 22 alleged "huge mass graves"

https://codohforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=16876#p16876

Maybe the remaining 49,989 jews are all buried in the "well grave"?

You can prove that the "well grave" actually exists, can't you Callafangers?

And let's not forget what that low IQ freak Roberta Muehlenkamp said:

nos. 9, 10 and 11 are very small and therefore shouldn't be called "huge mass graves" but merely "graves"

[Stubble]

I'm willing to grant and maximize g51, g52, g53 and g54 and still tell exterminationists that it amounts to a thimble.

The reason for this is the contemporary multi witness maps that line up with the GPR returns.

Are the 'witnesses' not shown as likely to claim any garbage pit was actually a corpse pit?

I find these compelling because they involve a group of witnesses and are the only maps of their kind, further, they indicate the grave space where the GPR returns are.

KUDLIK, WIERNIK, TRAUTSOLT MAP

KUDLIK, LAKS, PLATKIEWICZ MAP

And one other found in 'TORC' by Mattogno

http://www.deathcamps.org/treblinka/maps.html

[Callafangers]

notice that all of your questions are qualitative in nature -- they all use the word "conclusively", which is a standard that has no universal definition, thus it becomes a matter of opinion; not fact, not measurable, not verifiable... so, it cannot ever explain what did or did not happen.

This is bullshit magical thinking that you are hiding behind.

Can you conclusive prove to yourself that you have a dick?

My dick is immediately measurable, Keen (just ask your mother - kidding).

Some people will say "conclusively proven" is established once an excavation has found "many corpses" which align with witnesses saying "millions of corpses". I would argue these people are morons and that the bar for "conclusively proven" is much higher than that. You don't even make clear where you place that bar. I have not heard you mention Andrzej Kola, Łukaszkiewicz, or others. Instead you seem to dismiss them outright but you never explain why.

Why is that? Don't you understand that this is at the core of the matters you are challenging? Your position could be much more convincing if you could simply get others to dismiss these findings in the same absolute and nonchalant way that you do.

[Keen]

notice that all of your questions are qualitative in nature -- they all use the word "conclusively", which is a standard that has no universal definition, thus it becomes a matter of opinion; not fact, not measurable, not verifiable... so, it cannot ever explain what did or did not happen.

This is bullshit magical thinking that you are hiding behind.

Can you conclusive prove to yourself that you have a dick?

My dick is immediately measurable, Keen (just ask your mother - kidding).

Some people will say "conclusively proven" is established once an excavation has found "many corpses" which align with witnesses saying "millions of corpses". I would argue these people are morons and that the bar for "conclusively proven" is much higher than that. You don't even make clear where you place that bar. I have not heard you mention Andrzej Kola, Łukaszkiewicz, or others. Instead you seem to dismiss them outright but you never explain why.

Why is that? Don't you understand that this is at the core of the matters you are challenging? Your position could be much more convincing if you could simply get others to dismiss these findings in the same absolute and nonchalant way that you do.

Says the dodger that could give Nessie lessons in dodging.

Callafangers,

List all of the Belzec graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

And don't forget this

https://codohforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=18624#p18624