The shrunken heads from Buchenwald, Grok says they're legit

[Joe Splink]

I was surprised to discover that grok and eepseek contend that the Nazis did shrink the heads of two prisoners and that they were presented as legitimate evidence of Nazi atrocities at Nuremberg !!!!!

Grok's summary:
After reviewing the primary evidence from Buchenwald's 1945 liberation, Nuremberg trial records (Exhibit USA-254), and testimony from camp pathology workers (especially Kurt Sitte and Gustav Wegerer), I conclude that the two shrunken heads shown or referenced at Nuremberg came from Polish prisoners who were executed at Buchenwald concentration camp. The SS staff in the camp’s pathology department—on orders from SS doctor Hans Müller—decapitated the victims, removed the skulls, and deliberately shrank the skin using a process involving peeling, filling with sand, and applying heat/pressure for 24–48 hours. This was an act of localized sadism and trophy-making by individual SS personnel in one camp, not part of any systematic or centralized Nazi extermination program.

I admit, I'm astounded!

[Eye of Zyclone]

[Fred Ziffel]

US prosecutor Judge Thomas Dodd at Nuremberg gave one of them the oath
Here are some other creepy photos

[Hektor]

US prosecutor Judge Thomas Dodd at Nuremberg gave one of them the oath
Here are some other creepy photos

They were presented as legit evidence for long. But it's mostly that Holocaust evidences aren't to be questioned no matter how ridiculous they are. It's quite literally a cult.


As far as Grok or AI are concerned. It aways depends on how the LLM is primed, trained and instructed by the owners. More importantly may however be what it continuously finds in the 'authoritative sources' meaning articles from main stream academia. And there 'the consensus' is that 'the Holocaust was real' and that includes claims like homicidal gassing or the six million, as well as extermination program (instead of just physical removal). Anything else is to be interpreted in this.



Now as for the shrunken heads. Fair to consider them real artefacts. That they were manufactured in a concentration camp like Buchenwald is however not a reasonable belief, as they are in line with being other origin.

[Wahrheitssucher]

Wow!
“We need to give direction to our non-Jewish friends.”

[Eye of Zyclone]

Grok's summary:
This was an act of localized sadism and trophy-making by individual SS personnel in one camp, not part of any systematic or centralized Nazi extermination program.

It is now conceded that these [Jivaro] shrunken heads were "not part of any systematic or centralized Nazi extermination program," but such grisly artefacts were initially used to precondition people into believing any horror story about that alleged Nazi extermination program. It made people accept "the premise that there is no depravity which is impossible" for the Nazis. Those grisly artefacts were major primers of the Holohoax scam, which exempted the victors of WW2 from ever providing any solid evidence for the propaganda lies they selected for posterity and thus planted in history books.

[Eye of Zyclone]

Wow!
“We need to give direction to our non-Jewish friends.”

Still better than "we need to deceive and brainwash our unchosen slaves," isn't it?

[Joe Splink]

It is now conceded that these [Jivaro] shrunken heads were "not part of any systematic or centralized Nazi extermination program,"

No. The (implicit) point of my post was not that the shrunken heads were an integral part of the Nazi program, but that Grok said the shrunken heads were real and created by the Nazis, and that grok is a representation of mainstream hoax 'scholarship', so the shrunken heads are generally considered legit by mainstream hoax scholarship. I gave a brief summary of the response, but the complete response had details and references to mainstream hoax scholarship. I thought I was asking grok a 'gotcha' question, as I thought that they had long been considered fakes, i.e. from Brazil or some such. Grok's response, after some discussion, gave the camp where they were created, the individuals involved, and the process used to do the shrinking! That's why I was astounded by the answer.

The bottom line is that we haven't put the slightest dent in the hoax. The only exception I discovered in my discussion is that mainstream hoax scholarship doesn't claim that Mengele sewed twins together!

[Eye of Zyclone]

It is now conceded that these [Jivaro] shrunken heads were "not part of any systematic or centralized Nazi extermination program,"

No, the (implicit) point of my post was not that Grok said the shrunken heads were legit, but that grok is a representation of mainstream hoax 'scholarship', so the shrunken heads are generally considered legit by mainstream hoax scholarship.

I had understood your point and I didn't say that the orthodox/antirevisionist scholars have now dropped the Nazi-shrunken-heads lie, but I nevertheless decided to elaborate on the last sentence of Grok's summary in your previous post in order to explain how the Holohoax was successfully sold after WW2. I hope that it was not too much off topic.

[Joe Splink]

I was elaborating on the last sentence of Grok's summary in your previous post.

The part of the last sentence you elaborated on does imply that mainstream scholars accept the shrunken heads as legit.

[Eye of Zyclone]

I was elaborating on the last sentence of Grok's summary in your previous post.

The part of the last sentence you quoted does imply that mainstream scholars accept the shrunken heads as real.

Well, they do (even they usually keep from talking about it and try to belittle its scale when they mention it), don't they?

[Joe Splink]

Correction to my previous post: The part of the last sentence you elaborated on does imply that mainstream scholars have rejected the shrunken heads hoax.

.....and try to belittle its scale when they mention it)

Just as you did with your selective emphasis.

[Eye of Zyclone]

Correction to my previous post: The part of the last sentence you elaborated on does imply that mainstream scholars have rejected the shrunken heads hoax.

I understand it as meaning that academic historians have NOT rejected the shrunken heads hoax, but now claim that it was just an isolated incident ("an act of localized sadism and trophy-making") rather than a Nazi policy ("not part of any systematic or centralized Nazi extermination program").

.....and try to belittle its scale when they mention it)

Just as you did with your selective emphasis.

What's wrong with you?

[Joe Splink]

What's wrong with you?
Not a thing. The sentence has two parts, and you chose to emphasize the part that 'minimizes' the hoax. A diversionary tactic. Just as your claim that a picture of Anne Frank taken after the war had ended doesn't look anything like Anne Frank. So, I'm suspicious of you.

It reminded me of a funny vid I saw yesterday, as it's a little off topic I didn't post it .. but ... now I will .... (just for laughs, delete if inappropriate)

[Eye of Zyclone]

What's wrong with you?
Not a thing. The sentence has two parts, and you chose to emphasize the part that 'minimizes' the hoax. A diversionary tactic. Just as your claim that a picture of Anne Frank taken after the war had ended doesn't look anything like Anne Frank. So, I'm suspicious of you.

OK, now I see what's wrong with you. You're upset that I ruined your great discovery, which was frankly more embarrassing than convincing. Too much ego. Not enough maturity.

The sentence has two parts, and you chose to emphasize the part that 'minimizes' the hoax. A diversionary tactic.

No, I chose to elaborate on the part that reveals the big picture (i.e. one of the tricks used to create and sell the Holohoax). I find it more interesting than a nearly forgotten oddity like the shrunken heads lie itself. Sorry for trying to broaden your autistic echo chamber.