Is that the part where so-called revisionists get to speak about their various, largely unevidenced, so-called revisions to history? Will that mean they will finally settle the debate on whether the AR camps were transit camps, customs posts, property sorting centres, hygiene facilities, or stops to change to wider gauge trains? Will they agree on whether the Kremas were showers, bomb shelters, corpse stores or delousing chambers?HolocaustAcademy wrote: ↑Thu Aug 28, 2025 12:48 am ...
– Holocaust and History: Taboo between Dogma and Dissent.
For this section, papers should focus on the actual historical record: on the various ways this event has been defined by historians; on findings – new and old – correcting the established record and our understanding of it; on how Holocaust historiography has been revised over time by both orthodox and skeptic scholars.
Ironically, all of those things you just listed for what revisionists believe are credibly evidenced (the only debate between revisionists is what proportion of each of these most accurately characterizes these camps), whereas your beliefs (e.g. that there are millions of Jews underground there) have been tested and shown as false.Nessie wrote: ↑Thu Aug 28, 2025 6:37 am Is that the part where so-called revisionists get to speak about their various, largely unevidenced, so-called revisions to history? Will that mean they will finally settle the debate on whether the AR camps were transit camps, customs posts, property sorting centres, hygiene facilities, or stops to change to wider gauge trains? Will they agree on whether the Kremas were showers, bomb shelters, corpse stores or delousing chambers?
Except you lack any eyewitness, despite over a million people being sent to those camps and the hundreds of camp staff, SS and Jewish. You also lack any documentary evidence of people leaving the camps in any significant numbers.Callafangers wrote: ↑Thu Aug 28, 2025 8:37 am .....
Ironically, all of those things you just listed for what revisionists believe are credibly evidenced
Are you now claiming the camps were multi-purpose? The reason why so-called revisionists cannot actually agree on a revision of the purpose of the AR camps, is because none of the suggested revisions is well enough evidenced to produce a consensus. Whereas there is a consensus amongst historians. That proves AR camps as death camps is the best evidenced purpose.... (the only debate between revisionists is what proportion of each of these most accurately characterizes these camps)...
Your methodology for "testing" the evidence is flawed and unique to Holocaust denial/revisionism. For example;... whereas your beliefs (e.g. that there are millions of Jews underground there) have been tested and shown as false.
Oh, and there's the missing wood... d'oh!
Nessie, I can't wait to see the paper that you submitt that proves 2.145 million jews are buried in 100 "huge mass graves" at B, C, P, S & TII.Nessie wrote: ↑Thu Aug 28, 2025 6:37 amIs that the part where so-called revisionists get to speak about their various, largely unevidenced, so-called revisions to history? Will that mean they will finally settle the debate on whether the AR camps were transit camps, customs posts, property sorting centres, hygiene facilities, or stops to change to wider gauge trains? Will they agree on whether the Kremas were showers, bomb shelters, corpse stores or delousing chambers?HolocaustAcademy wrote: ↑Thu Aug 28, 2025 12:48 am ...
– Holocaust and History: Taboo between Dogma and Dissent.
For this section, papers should focus on the actual historical record: on the various ways this event has been defined by historians; on findings – new and old – correcting the established record and our understanding of it; on how Holocaust historiography has been revised over time by both orthodox and skeptic scholars.
You said;
OK!
OK!First, produce that evidence, so I can see it, thanks.
Right. And our paper will prove that 925,000 jews were moved to a new location called Treblinka II, correct?
Oh, about that photo; our paper will have to include your answers to these questions:How is a photo of buried human remains at TII, evidence of resettlement?
Where exactly within the boundary of Treblinka II were these bones located? You can prove that that photo was taken within the boundary of the camp, can't you? And those bones have been proven to be human, correct? We can't include that photo in our paper as evidence of resettlement if we can't prove that the bones are human and the photo was taken within the boundary of the camp, right?
You are clearly getting confused. The evidence of mass transports to TII comes from Nazi documentation such as the Hofle telegram and eyewitnesses from Jews on the transports, Polish rail workers and SS camp staff.Keen wrote: ↑Thu Aug 28, 2025 1:21 pmRight. And our paper will prove that 925,000 jews were moved to a new location called Treblinka II, correct?
Nessie:
Oh, about that photo; our paper will have to include your answers to these questions:How is a photo of buried human remains at TII, evidence of resettlement?
Where exactly within the boundary of Treblinka II were these bones located? You can prove that that photo was taken within the boundary of the camp, can't you? And those bones have been proven to be human, correct? We can't include that photo in our paper as evidence of resettlement if we can't prove that the bones are human and the photo was taken within the boundary of the camp, right?
and narrow it down to this as our OP:Nessie:
The majority of the eyewitnesses, those who worked inside the AR camps, Chelmno... all admit that mass killings took place.
The Nazis were not trying to magically disappear the corpses and the graves, as they knew that is impossible.
All the mass graves dug by the Nazis, and the corpses they cremated, are still at the AR camps and Chelmno.
The geophysical survey work has identified rectangular pits with straight edges and ramps at TII.
The sheer volume of evidence for mass graves at TII... Mass graves are proven.
By all normal standards of evidencing, they are proven.
I can point to them in the ground.
There are 11 at Treblinka II:
G32, G1, G44, G4, G38, G36, G50, G51, G52, G53 & 54.
But I think we need to add Ponary as well.Nessie:
The Nazis were not trying to magically disappear the corpses and the graves, as they knew that is impossible.
All the mass graves dug by the Nazis, and the corpses they cremated, are still at the AR camps and Chelmno.
Mass graves are proven. By all normal standards of evidencing, they are proven.
Right. And what better way to show you my proof than co-authoring a paper with you on resettlement?
That's what I'm doing here in this thread.First, produce that evidence, so I can see it, thanks.
Belzec: 600,000
Chelmno: 300,000
Ponary: 70,000
Sobibor: 250,000
Treblinka II: 925,000
Total for these 5 sites: 2.145 million.