Jewish Genetics

[HansHill]

Hmm



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashkenaz

[Wahrheitssucher]

Hmm



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashkenaz

This discussion is getting more and more crazy.
Are you seriously suggesting that the ashkenazim are descended from a great grandson of the mythological person Noah?

The North American city of San Antonio derives its name from a christian saint from Portugal who died in 1231.
Does that prove all the original population and people now living in San Antonio are Portuguese?



Why don’t you want to accept the self-evident reality that for all discernible, practible purposes ashkenazi jews are Europeans?

[HansHill]

Hmm



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashkenaz

This discussion is getting more and more crazy.
Are you seriously suggesting that the ashkenazim are descended from a great grandson of the mythological person Noah?

Absolutely not - my argument was about the etymology of the word, and I was not suggesting a direct genetic link whatsoever.

The North American city of San Antonio derives its name from a christian saint from Portugal who died in 1231.
Does that prove all the original population and people now living in San Antonio are Portuguese?

Again, absolutely not, and that's a very silly thing to suggest was what I mean. Studying the etymology of the word at best shows us a cultural link, but does nothing to point to the genetics of the current people living there. It was yourself who actually introduced the argument that etymology implies genetic relationship.

Why don’t you want to accept the self-evident reality that for all discernible, practible purposes ashkenazi jews are Europeans?

Because if we call anybody with European admixture "Europeans" then the word loses all meaning. Again back to the Mestizo argument which you don't seem to have responded to yet - if we call the Mestizos "European" due to their 20-40% European admixture, this completely trivialises what we mean when we say "Europeans". Everybody knows they are not Europeans.

[Wahrheitssucher]

Hmm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashkenaz

This discussion is getting more and more crazy.
Are you seriously suggesting that the ashkenazim are descended from a great grandson of the mythological person Noah?

Absolutely not — my argument was about the etymology of the word, and I was not suggesting a direct genetic link whatsoever.

And the etymology of the name for the Atlantic Ocean is to Atlas, the Titan in Greek mythology. That means nothing in this conversation. The name Ashkenaz was used by ancient jews to refer to GERMANY (as I demonstrated). That European converts to Judaism chose to name their homeland named after a mythological Hebrew personage means nothing in terms of genetic DNA.

The North American city of San Antonio derives its name from a christian saint from Portugal who died in 1231.
Does that prove all the original population and people now living in San Antonio are Portuguese?

Again, absolutely not, and that's a very silly thing to suggest was what I mean.

it applies the same logic of etymology.

Studying the etymology of the word at best shows us a cultural link, but does nothing to point to the genetics of the current people living there.

I agree. We appear to be talking past each other.

It was yourself who actually introduced the argument that etymology implies genetic relationship.

No I didn’t. I tried to bring this discussion down to a practicable level. And I did that because it seems to me that you want to deny that Ashkenazis are to every intent and purpose Europeans.
I had just replied:

Ok, then let’s describe them as a European cline. I’ll go along with that. That still makes them Europeans. They are Europeans in almost every way, not ‘semites’. And that I maintain IS the bottom line here.

…if we call anybody with European admixture "Europeans" then the word loses all meaning. Again back to the Mestizo argument which you don't seem to have responded to yet — if we call the Mestizos "European" due to their 20-40% European admixture, this completely trivialises what we mean when we say "Europeans". Everybody knows they are not Europeans.

My point is that Mestizos and mulatos are discernibly NOT white caucasians of European ethnic origin. Whereas the Ashkenazi jews are. Look at the ones who are currently organising and implementing the mass-murder and ethnic cleansing of the actual descendants of the ancient Israelites in occupied Palestine. It would be hard to distinguish them in a crowd of Europeans.

[Stubble]

Just gonna leave this here.

[HansHill]

I think this is approaching it from completely the wrong angle. You are bending over backwards trying to factor them in as Europeans based on their 40% European admixture, rather than factoring them out based on their 60% Middle Eastern admixture.

Looked at from that perspective, its clearly ridiculous to describe an ethnic group that is 60% Middle Eastern as European.

At best, they are a European cline, that is, an offshoot of two "parent races" splintering off, mixing, and becoming culturally distinct & isolated from each parent race.

....And if the hybrid subsequently becomes geographically and culturally separated from the parent races, a case may develop for terming it a separate race. These racial hybrids are known as “clines".....

- Ed Dutton, as quoted earlier