My Very Own Sub-Forum on CODOH!

[Callafangers]

Says the dodger that could give Nessie lessons in dodging.

Callafangers,

List all of the Belzec graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

And don't forget this

https://codohforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=18624#p18624

It's not dodging, Keen -- it's laziness and a lack of interest. I have not memorized the maps of Treblinka, Sobibor, and Belzec and all of their respective alleged grave numbers, nor do I have interest in ever doing this. What I am interested in is whether any of these locations have any actual/excavated corpse material findings. There is only one such instance I am aware of at Treblinka, which I have already described to you. And at Belzec/Sobibor, there have been hundreds of core samples, dozens of which contain at least some amount of corpse material.

My lack of interest in doing the homework you have assigned me isn't any sort of victory for you, but this is obvious. Your insistence on my doing so despite this seems a reflection of your inability to address this topic in a more nuanced way.

[Keen]

Says the dodger that could give Nessie lessons in dodging.

Callafangers,

List all of the Belzec graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

List all of the Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question that you believe currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: _?_.

And don't forget this

https://codohforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=18624#p18624

It's not dodging, Keen -- it's laziness and a lack of interest. I have not memorized the maps of Treblinka, Sobibor, and Belzec and all of their respective alleged grave numbers, nor do I have interest in ever doing this. What I am interested in is whether any of these locations have any actual/excavated corpse material findings. There is only one such instance I am aware of at Treblinka, which I have already described to you. And at Belzec/Sobibor, there have been hundreds of core samples, dozens of which contain at least some amount of corpse material.

My lack of interest in doing the homework you have assigned me isn't any sort of victory for you, but this is obvious. Your insistence on my doing so despite this seems a reflection of your inability to address this topic in a more nuanced way.

Look at Nessie, err, Callafangers run!

No wonder he refused to answer the question about his dick!

[Callafangers]

Look at Nessie, err, Callafangers run!

No wonder he refused to answer the question about his dick!

Look at Keen run! He's afraid to address this directly:

What I am interested in is whether any of these locations have any actual/excavated corpse material findings. There is only one such instance I am aware of at Treblinka, which I have already described to you. And at Belzec/Sobibor, there have been hundreds of core samples, dozens of which contain at least some amount of corpse material.

My lack of interest in doing the homework you have assigned me isn't any sort of victory for you, but this is obvious. Your insistence on my doing so despite this seems a reflection of your inability to address this topic in a more nuanced way.

Why is Keen so afraid? What are you waiting for, Keen?

[Keen]

Callafangers:

there have been hundreds of core samples [at Belzec and Sobibor], dozens of which contain at least some amount of corpse material.

Callafangers,

In total, how many single, disconnected human teeth have been tangibly discovered within the 33 alleged Belzec graves / cremation pits in question: _?_.

In total, how many single, disconnected human teeth have been tangibly discovered within the 22 alleged Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question: _?_.

List all of the Belzec graves / cremation pits in question that you believe actually exist and currently contain at least an iota of human remains: _?_.

List all of the Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question that you believe actually exist and currently contain at least an iota of human remains: _?_.

Now let's watch Callafangers run!

[Keen]

It's not dodging, Keen -- it's laziness and a lack of interest.

And let's not forget stupidity!

I have not memorized the maps of Treblinka, Sobibor, and Belzec and all of their respective alleged grave numbers, nor do I have interest in ever doing this.

Then come back when you have learned a thing or two then, OK? Oh, and perhaps you could grow up a bit as well?

[Stubble]

JFC Keen, friendly! I repeat friendly! Check your fire man.

FFS.

Remember folks, Fangers is not just a friendly, he's also an admin.

[Callafangers]

JFC Keen, friendly! I repeat friendly! Check your fire man.

FFS.

Remember folks, Fangers is not just a friendly, he's also an admin.

Lol, I can take the heat. We're already in the "Quarantine" subforum so I think the rules can be a little bendy here but it's unfortunate Keen is approaching this more combatively than is necessary. We could do much better work as a group without the "friendly-fire", as you've suggested.

[Keen]

I think the actual total there is likely much lower, something like 15-20k at Sobibor

"Think"? "Likely"?

How much human remains have ACTUALLY been proven to exist within the boundary of the Sobibor camp - as in - NO LESS THAN?

You can use any standard of proof that you want. Just tell us what it is. (BTW, the standard of proof question is the one the reality deniers fear the most.)



(There is also - with 100% certainty.)

If you need help with the answer (and I know you do) go here:

https://codohforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=16876#p16876

[Keen]

I want to reevaluate this map from Obóz straceń w Treblince.

Excellent post pilgrimofdark, thank you.

But would you be so kind as to move it to the - Evidence relating to TII (Treblinka) - thread?

https://codohforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=601

I think it would be more appropriate to post it there.

Thanks.

[Callafangers]

"Think"? "Likely"?

How much human remains have ACTUALLY been proven to exist within the boundary of the Sobibor camp - as in - NO LESS THAN?

You can use any standard of proof that you want. Just tell us what it is. (BTW, the standard of proof question is the one the reality deniers fear the most.)

You're asking for precise quantification which we both know has not been achieved, hence it is pointless to ask.

I have already stated clearly that the precise quantity of remains found within the boundary of Sobibor is likely a very tiny number amounting to maybe ~50 or so corpses' worth at the very most, if we are counting the physical material actually unearthed and reported on from core samples by Kola et al. But a reasonable person would be willing to extrapolate to some degree -- that is, unless you assume that Kola and his team just-so-happened to place their drills at the only locations in the entire camp that had any corpse remains. It is this extrapolation which forms a big part of any reasonable estimate of actual corpse material on-site. You circumvent this question entirely by simply ignoring it.

In some ways, you are right to do so. The scale and nature of the alleged crime certainly warrants a more complete investigation (and excavation). But my intention is to simply be as reasonable as possible within the constraints of which investigations have already taken place.

[Keen]

You're asking for precise quantification which we both know has not been achieved, hence it is pointless to ask.

Utter bullshit.

Do you deny that graves have been archaeologically discovered and human remains have been tangibly located within those graves within the boundary of Sobibor - Yes. - or - No. - ??

I have already stated clearly that the precise quantity of remains found within the boundary of Sobibor is likely a very tiny number amounting to maybe ~50 or so corpses' worth at the very most

Fine. Let's see you refine that statement and help you develop your statement of fact that reflects that beleif.

I believe, based on the evidence that I have seen, that the remains of no less than _?_ people currently lie within the boundary of the Sobibor camp.

I believe, based on the evidence that I have seen, that no less than _?_ graves (mass and single combined) have been archaeologically / forensically / scientifically discovered within the boundary of the Sobibor camp.

Again, if you need any help, go here: https://codohforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=16876#p16876

[Keen]

I have not memorized the maps of Treblinka, Sobibor, and Belzec and all of their respective alleged grave numbers...

What I am interested in is whether any of these locations have any actual/excavated corpse material findings.

Well, that's what I'm interested in too Callafangers.

To keep things simple, let's focus on Sobibor.

Here is Sobibor "huge mass grave" #12:



Here is Sobibor "huge mass grave" #13:



Here is Sobibor "huge mass grave" #14:



Here is Sobibor "huge mass grave" #16:



There's your "actual/excavated corpse material findings" for you that you are interested in Callafangers.

Callafangers, do you deny that graves (mass and/or single) have been archaeologically discovered and human remains have been tangibly located within those graves within the boundary of Sobibor - Yes. - or - No. - ??

Callafangers:
You're asking for precise quantification which we both know has not been achieved, hence it is pointless to ask.

Regarding the "standard applied in US civil courts", aka "preponderance of evidence", it is defined as:

preponderance /prĭ-pŏn′dər-əns/
noun
1. Superiority in weight, force, importance, or influence.

In other words, it just has to be more likely than not that the evidence shows a certain number of corpses at a given location. But who is the arbiter of how and whether this standard is met? You and I are not US courts, we are not at trial, and so it is really just conflicting opinions

Callafangers, how many total graves (mass and/or single) do see in the 4 photos above?

How many total corpses do you see in those graves?

[Stubble]

Grave 16 may not be contemporary to the event alleged at Sobibor. I just wanted to share that caveat. That particular 'huge mass grave' may be from a different event at that particular place.

[Keen]

Grave 16 may not be contemporary to the event alleged at Sobibor. I just wanted to share that caveat. That particular 'huge mass grave' may be from a different event at that particular place.

I am aware of this unsubstantiated allegation, but thank you for mentioning it.

In the context of determining the actual number of "huge mass graves" that have been archaelologically / forensically / scientifically proven to actually exist within the boundary of the camp, it must be included.

[Stubble]

Fair enough, I'd be remissed had I not mentioned it.

Carry on.