The Charlie Kirk assassination and the impulse to declare things as forgeries

[Stubble]

I'm going to stress again that the projectile (bullet) is the only open question I have about the shooting currently. I need to see the unspent ammunition.

The shot isn't particularly difficult, and smuggling the weapon wasn't particularly complex.

The lack of an exit wound for a 30-06 at 140 yards is, a problem. A very large problem. The bullet was still charged with around 2,200'/lb of energy. This explains the massive damage, but, not the bullet track.

The only projectile I can think of that would have done this is a 165gr Sierra Game King HPBT.

For reference;



Having taken many deer with an 06, can confirm, it is a straight pass even with a soft point or similar.

[Wahrheitssucher]

…the projectile (bullet) is the only open question I have about the shooting currently…

I have MANY “open” questions.

I suggest if anyone doesn’t want to be duped and has an interest in truth and accuracy, they also should be “open” on many things at this point in time.

BUTLER KILLINGS
I still have MANY “open” questions regarding the Butler shooting by Thomas Crooks:.

SECURITY.
- Why was anyone allowed by security to be on the roof with a gun for so long after crowds detected him and notified cops?
- Why was Trump allowed to go out onto the podium after Crooks had been detected on the roof with a gun?
- why was the security so lapse and slow?
- was the assassination attempt on Trump permitted / allowed to happen?
- Why was the security operation so badly handled? Was it ‘bad’ deliberately?
- Has any investigation been made to ascertain possible foreign inteference, e.g. sayanim operators within the ‘security’ apparatus?
- As there definitely ARE jews with strong zionist loyalties, WHY is that possibility never investigated as would if it was any other potential foreign involvement?
- Why has there been no public report of the security failings and how they could have happened?

CROOKS.
- Why did Crooks want to kill Trump and not care if he killed and injured crowd members in the process?
- What was the motivation for such an intelligent young man with his whole life ahead of him?
- Why hasn’t investigation into any of those questions been made public?
- Was he assisted or put up to it by anyone in any way at all?
- Why has there never been any detailed re-assessment made public of those persons outside of Butler who whistleblowers leaked Crooks had met and texted with Crooks prior to the shooting (we don’t need names if they were innocent, just an explanation).

—————————————————

KIRK KILLING
There are similarly many “open” questions with the Kirk killing.

TYLER ROBINSON
- was that really Tyler Robinson filmed in the released surveillance video arriving limping?
- was that the same person captured running across the roof and dropping down off it after the shot?
- even if the filmed suspect IS proved to be Tyler Robinson, did he fire the fatal shot into Kirk’s neck captured on video?
- if it was Tyler Robinson who fired, did he fire a shot from his grandad’s Mauser 98 .03 06?
- if it was from that rifle, what type of bullet did he use?

THE WOUND
- why wasn’t there an exit wound?
- was a bullet found in Kirk’s body by a coroner/surgeon?

THE FBI
- why didn’t the FBI inform the public of all those wound details?
- why did they allow speculation about whether there was an exit wound, a bullet recovered, an autopsy being done?
- why did the FBI only release some wierd types of evidence but not more conclusive evidence incriminating Tyler?
- why did they release so little evidence of the whole shooting and then in a way that permitted and encouraged speculation and rumours?
- what surveillance video do they have?
- why haven’t they informed us?
- do they have surveillance video of the suspect making his way to the shooting position and taking the shot?
- if they do why haven’t they informed us?
- do they have GPS tracking of Tyler Robinson’s phone at the time immediately preceding and after the killing?
- if they do why haven’t they informed us?
- why did they release supposed ‘confession’ text messages but with time stamps removed?
- why did they attempt to put an unconstitutional, possibly illegal gag order on witnesses?

POSSIBLE DUAL-NATIONALITY, ZIONIST, JEWISH-AMERICAN INVOLVEMENT
- Has any investigation been made to ascertain possible foreign inteference, e.g. sayanim operators within the ‘security’, autopsy, police and FBI investigation, trial staff?
- As there definitely ARE jews with strong zionist loyalties, WHY is that possibility never investigated as it would be if it was any other potential foreign involvement?

ISRAEL
- if Israel is not involved why did their PM Netanyahu personally release two filmed appeals declaring his innocence of any involvement in the killing?
- what sort of Prime Minister would feel a need to do that?
- why did Netanyahu tweet condemnation of the killing so quickly?
- why did Israel release glowing obituaries SO SOON? were they pre-prepared?
- Why did these deceitfully misrepresent Kirk’s changed perception of Israeli actions and Netanyahu?
- why was there so much search enquiry from Israel, admitted by Google, of key persons and places in Kirk’s killing in the days BEFORE his killing!??
________________________

NETANYAHU
TIME OF OFFICIAL DEATH ANNOUNCEMENT AND NETANYAHU’S 1st TWEET
Charlie Kirk was shot on 10th September 2025, at approximately 8:30 PM MDT (10:30 PM EDT).
Netanyahu's tweet was made at approximately 21:21 GMT (2:21 PM EDT) on September 10, 2025, shortly after the shooting was reported. Bibi’s tweet was condemning the “murder” and describing Kirk as a "lion-hearted friend of Israel".
So Netanyahu made the first official, public response notifying the world of Kirk’s DEATH only 3 hours and 51 minutes after the shooting.

Summary:
• Netanyahu's 1st tweet condemning Kirk’s death was 3 hours and 51 minutes after the shooting.
____________________________

That’s just some ‘open’ questions that immediately came to mind.


P.S. Netanyahu posted his tweet at almost 02:00 am in the morning in Israel-time.


GROK — replying to my questions:

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's tweet condemning the "murder" was posted on X (formerly Twitter) at 3:50 p.m. MT (which corresponds to 1:50 a.m. IST the next day in Israel, accounting for the ~10-hour time difference).
The tweet read: "Charlie Kirk was murdered for speaking truth and defending freedom. A lion-hearted friend of Israel, he fought the lies and stood tall for Judeo-Christian civilization. I spoke to him only two weeks ago and invited him to Israel. Sadly, that visit will not take place. We lost an irreplaceable voice for freedom. All people of goodwill must condemn this horrific murder and demand justice for Charlie." This was Netanyahu's initial public condemnation, explicitly using the term "murdered" twice and calling for universal condemnation.
SUMMARY: Time after coroner’s declaration = approximately 20 minutes.

Official US Institution Report
The first official US institutional declaration of Charlie Kirk's death came from President Donald Trump on September 10, 2025, at 2:40 p.m. MT, via a post on Truth Social stating, "The Great, and even Legendary, Charlie Kirk, is dead".
As the sitting US President, this served as the authoritative federal confirmation, prompting flags at half-mast and a White House video address later that evening prematurely blaming "radical left" rhetoric.
The hospital (Timpanogos Regional) pronounced him dead earlier (around 1:00–2:00 p.m. MT after transport at 12:23 p.m. MT), but did not issue a public statement.
The Utah Department of Public Safety and local police gave no formal death announcement.
The FBI's initial custody reports (later retracted) were post-2:40 p.m. MT.
SUMMARY: Time after coroner pronouncement = approximately 1 hour 10 minutes.

Official Mainstream News Reports
The first official mainstream news reports confirming Charlie Kirk's death from the shooting occurred on September 10, 2025, around 2:50 p.m. MT (Mountain Time), approximately 10 minutes after President Donald Trump's announcement on Truth Social. Major outlets like ABC News, NBC News, The New York Times, and AP News entered "breaking news" mode, reporting Kirk had been pronounced dead at Timpanogos Regional Hospital in Orem, Utah, following the 12:20 p.m. MT shooting at Utah Valley University. For example, ABC News published a visual timeline at 2:40 p.m. MT referencing Trump's post, with full confirmation and details (including the neck wound from a sniper shot) in updates by 2:50 p.m. MT. Prior to this, reports focused on the shooting and Kirk's critical condition, but the death was not verified in mainstream sources until Trump's announcement triggered widespread coverage.
SUMMARY: Time after coroner pronouncement = approximately 1 hour 20 minutes.

[Stubble]

The Butler shooting merits it's own thread, just like the JFK assassination.

Hammer's tweet about public execution stands out. I genuinely think any outside involvement in the assassination would have been nudging the accused and facilitation of a lapse in security with regard to securing the rooftops.

I see how the fellow got on the roof. The shot isn't anything to write home about. The lack of an exit wound from a 30-06 is problematic.

I'm not going to say your questions are invalid, or even your conjecture. I'm simply saying that those aren't my questions. Currently I have 1 outstanding question with this one.

From the audio forensics it's 1 shot from a high powered rifle at about 140 yards. That settles the question of the shot for me when I see the accused with the rifle leaving the scene.

/shrug

The expansion cavity is huge and the damage is extensive. A 30-06 absolutely could have caused that. I need to see the projectile.

A 'pen gun' isn't going to do that..

[Scott]

Scott is engaged in quite obvious, irrelevant, wall-of-text obfuscation and derailing.

I invite CODOH forum readers to ponder upon that for a moment.

WTF?

Okay, so the Candace Owens grifter's club thinks that "Lone Gunmen" can't happen without a big CIA, FBI, MI5, Mossad conspiracy, but that is just not true.

I admit that the Secret Service dropped the ball with the Trump security at Butler, Pennsylvania, but Trump really was shot in the ear and almost killed in 2024. Good Luck happens from time to time.

I'm not an admirer of de-Segregationist Chief Justice Earl Warren, but that does not mean that the Warren Commission really "Rushed to Judgement," as the Libertarian Jew lawyer/journalist Mark Lane claimed. In fact, the WC got the essentials quite correct.

Oswald acted alone. (These kinds of guys crawl out of the woodwork like cockroaches hoping to impress Jodie Foster.)

Historians have to learn how to weigh evidence and how to understand circumstantial evidence and how to put all of it into context.

And they need to treat facts the same way that competent scientists do with a METHOD or a process of REVISION rather than by putting knowledge onto a sacred shelf like Holy Scripture.

That is what CODOH has been about, as its founder, Bradley Smith intended, and I have been a student of Revisionism for a very long time.

I first subscribed to the Journal of Historical Review in 1979, and read the Dr. Arthur Butz book early in 1980. The classic Holocaust Revisionism issue in the Spotlight tabloid published just before Christmas in 1979 was highly influential to me, and it demonstrated clearly that the subject needed to be studied more closely.

In fact, this probably determined my decision to actually get a degree in History after studying and working in electronic engineering, radio communications, and broadcasting.

THEREFORE,

I gave the classic example of the JFK assassination in which the Warren Commission (correctly) said that the shooter acted alone ─ and I have shown on this thread how almost no one who has consumed mainstream media content for over fifty years knows more than jack squat about the actual event.

Lee Harvey Oswald was a dyslexic Marxist-Leninist misfit who wanted to shake things up violently at the age of 24, and who had trouble finding like-minded friends. Even the Soviets wanted nothing to do with him.

When ex-Marine coffee courier Oswald defected, the Soviets gave him a kushy job at a Minsk radio factory at a far higher salary than normal, but he was not a very good worker.

Dissatisfied, Oswald came back to the USA with a Russian wife ─ but nobody in either New Orleans where he was from or Texas was going to give a guy an "intellectual" or "important" job with a salary, inflated or otherwise, who struggled to fill out a job application or to write a simple business letter. Oswald had a learning diability but he wasn't dumb; he also read esoteric Marxist books. But, so what?

Oswald could not support his wife and two kids so he decided to leave her and emigrate to Cuba where the "real" Revolution was going on. Threatening to send Marina Oswald back to Russia usually kept the wifey in check; she did not notify the police when Oswald unsuccessfully attempted to kill General Ted Walker with his 6.5x52mm Carcano sniper rifle.

If you hang out at public places long enough, like the airport, or Dealey Plaza ─ where Oswald happened to be working at a warehouse when Kennedy and Johnson decided to have a parade in Dallas that went by there ─ you might run into celebrites or significant events at random. That is not a conspiracy. Occam's Razor is your friend.

This topic-thread is about the Kirk killing.

LOGICAL FACT:
If the empirical evidence of the numerous-angle video of Charlie Kirk’s neck wound could not have been caused by any calibre bullet shot from a Mauser 98 .03 06 rifle, then Tyler Robinson is NOT the shooter.

No, we have seen very little besides the charging documents so far.

The vaunted "FBI narrative" is simply that they released some video of the shooter's ingress and egress from a well-positioned camera at UVU, not the video of the shooting itself, more of which will likely come out in trial.

We have no BASIC ballistics report other than the claim that the shooter used a Model 98 Mauser action in .30-06 caliber with an expensive scope that once belonged to Tyler Robinson's Grandfather, and a picture of the rifle provided not by authorities but by the New York Times.

And some of this is information is from the Robinson texts and chats with his twinkerbell boyfriend, Lance Twiggs, to whom Tyler admits to the shooting.

The Candace Owen types were claiming that a 22 year old electrician student at Dixie State Univeristy in St. George, Utah who had also attended a semester at Utah State Univeristy in Logan was as dumb as a 3rd grader and therefore would not have used big words in chats like "vehicle" over simply "car," but that argument was soon debunked with actual vehicle collision police bodycam evidence.

There seems to be a clear proclivity in the minds of some for what I call Epistemological Nihilism, and that does not serve the cause of justice nor historians well. And this is coming from a natural Skeptic. For example, I had doubts about the Holocaust long before I started reading Revisionist research on the subject over 45 years ago.

Believers of the official ‘violent, leftist, tranny-supporting, anarchist murderer’ may feel free to keep on avoiding this rather basic and obvious fact. But that is the bottom line here.

The bottom line is that a lot of people don't really understand evidence and we have a "God of the Gaps" problem here.

Let me leave you with a video which explains medical examiner reports and death certificates from an actual mortician who easily debunks Candace Owens and her edgy podcaster bullshït.

A lot of the "facts" floating around the Kirk Assassination are in reality just hearsay if not made up out of wholecloth. Hopefully we will know more when it comes to trial but that might be awhile.

This video is over ten-minutes long but I think it is well worth watching and understanding:





And this video also from "Lauren the Mortician" is over eight-minutes long but it has some valuable information about autopsies:





The last point that I want to make is that with the Saint George Floyd overdose and heart attack, after him resisting arrest. The corporate news media was quick to call Floyd's 2020 death a "Murder," and they simply blinked at the autopsy evidence given in the trial of Police Officer Derek Chauvin in that St. Floyd was never choked nor had any substantial pressure applied to his neck or shoulder. For example, there was no bruising at the shoulders or neck, and the fragile hyoid bone in the throat was not broken.

This did not stop the police officers who tried to arrest Floyd ─ for attempting to pass a counterfeit bill at a convenience store and then passing out outside ─ from being railroaded, and the lead officer actually convicted of murder with BLM thugs marching outside and threatening the jurors. Chauvin was later shanked in prison, although he survived.

So even when people are getting their information from Shïtbird mainstream media rather than Tik-Tok, extreme skepticism is warranted.

I visited the O.J. Simpson murder scene in Brentwood, California myself a few months after the 1995 televised trial. And like the O.J. Simpson murder trial ─ where the half-Negro downtown Los Angeles jury acquitted the C-list celebrity of butchering his White ex-wife and her young Jewish waiter friend because an investigating detective once used the word Nïgger ─ I watched the entirety of the marsupial Chauvin trial televised from the People's Republic of Minnesota. I paid particular attention to the testimony of the pathologists who examined Saint George and conducted the postmortem.

Saint George was not murdered. Yeah, the news media blatantly lied.

This does not mean that Oswald was really a "patsy" as he claimed, or that MAGA or the Joos killed Charlie Kirk.

[Wahrheitssucher]

.
This topic-thread is about people: a.) denying unwelcome evidence,
by b.) too eagerly resorting to the suggestion that it’s forged,
in order to c.) maintain a belief-system.

I widened the topic to just avoiding evidence — or denying it exists — or refusing to intelligently question it — in order to maintain a belief-system.

Basically, denial can take many forms.

E.g. denying outright the possibility that something might be forged, when it clearly is very questionable, would be another.

Erm… say like if someone was totally believing — extremely unquestioningly — the alleged “confession” text messages released without timestamps that the FBI claim they found of Tyler Robinson self-contradictorily texting evidence saying he was leaving no evidence.



Or emphatically believing that the ethnically-European Zionist-occupiers of Palestine had absolutely nothing to do with Kirk’s murder even though the first politician to announce Kirk’s demise was their PM who posted a tweet in Israel at 02:00 am in the morning, ONLY 20 MINUTES after the coroner in America had pronounced Kirk officially dead.
Etc., etc., etc.

Consequently, listing some of the ‘open questions’ that still remain in the Butler assassination attempt and the complete silence on any subsequent investigation into Thomas Crooks is BANG ON TOPIC. It doesn’t need a separate thread.

It’s an example of people ignoring questionable evidence or governmental unevidenced narratives because they want to gullibly believe the official narrative.

And that is WHY all of Scott’s wall-of-text nonsense accusing investigators as ‘grifters’ and repeating irrelevant JFK debunked official narratives is OFF-TOPIC obfuscation.

…the projectile (bullet) is the only open question I have about the shooting currently…

I have MANY “open” questions.

I suggest if anyone doesn’t want to be duped and has an interest in truth and accuracy, they also should be “open” on many things at this point in time.

BUTLER KILLINGS
I still have MANY “open” questions regarding the Butler shooting by Thomas Crooks:.

SECURITY.
- Why was anyone allowed by security to be on the roof with a gun for so long after crowds detected him and notified cops?
- Why was Trump allowed to go out onto the podium after Crooks had been detected on the roof with a gun?
- why was the security so lapse and slow?
- was the assassination attempt on Trump permitted / allowed to happen?
- Why was the security operation so badly handled? Was it ‘bad’ deliberately?
- Has any investigation been made to ascertain possible foreign inteference, e.g. sayanim operators within the ‘security’ apparatus?
- As there definitely ARE jews with strong zionist loyalties, WHY is that possibility never investigated as would if it was any other potential foreign involvement?
- Why has there been no public report of the security failings and how they could have happened?

CROOKS.
- Why did Crooks want to kill Trump and not care if he killed and injured crowd members in the process?
- What was the motivation for such an intelligent young man with his whole life ahead of him?
- Why hasn’t investigation into any of those questions been made public?
- Was he assisted or put up to it by anyone in any way at all?
- Why has there never been any detailed re-assessment made public of those persons outside of Butler who whistleblowers leaked Crooks had met and texted with Crooks prior to the shooting (we don’t need names if they were innocent, just an explanation).

—————————————————

KIRK KILLING
There are similarly many “open” questions with the Kirk killing.

TYLER ROBINSON
- was that really Tyler Robinson filmed in the released surveillance video arriving limping?
- was that the same person captured running across the roof and dropping down off it after the shot?
- even if the filmed suspect IS proved to be Tyler Robinson, did he fire the fatal shot into Kirk’s neck captured on video?
- if it was Tyler Robinson who fired, did he fire a shot from his grandad’s Mauser 98 .03 06?
- if it was from that rifle, what type of bullet did he use?

THE WOUND
- why wasn’t there an exit wound?
- was a bullet found in Kirk’s body by a coroner/surgeon?

THE FBI
- why didn’t the FBI inform the public of all those wound details?
- why did they allow speculation about whether there was an exit wound, a bullet recovered, an autopsy being done?
- why did the FBI only release some wierd types of evidence but not more conclusive evidence incriminating Tyler?
- why did they release so little evidence of the whole shooting and then in a way that permitted and encouraged speculation and rumours?
- what surveillance video do they have?
- why haven’t they informed us?
- do they have surveillance video of the suspect making his way to the shooting position and taking the shot?
- if they do why haven’t they informed us?
- do they have GPS tracking of Tyler Robinson’s phone at the time immediately preceding and after the killing?
- if they do why haven’t they informed us?
- why did they release supposed ‘confession’ text messages but with time stamps removed?
- why did they attempt to put an unconstitutional, possibly illegal gag order on witnesses?

POSSIBLE DUAL-NATIONALITY, ZIONIST, JEWISH-AMERICAN INVOLVEMENT
- Has any investigation been made to ascertain possible foreign inteference, e.g. sayanim operators within the ‘security’, autopsy, police and FBI investigation, trial staff?
- As there definitely ARE jews with strong zionist loyalties, WHY is that possibility never investigated as it would be if it was any other potential foreign involvement?

ISRAEL
- if Israel is not involved why did their PM Netanyahu personally release two filmed appeals declaring his innocence of any involvement in the killing?
- what sort of Prime Minister would feel a need to do that?
- why did Netanyahu tweet condemnation of the killing so quickly?
- why did Israel release glowing obituaries SO SOON? were they pre-prepared?
- Why did these deceitfully misrepresent Kirk’s changed perception of Israeli actions and Netanyahu?
- why was there so much search enquiry from Israel, admitted by Google, of key persons and places in Kirk’s killing in the days BEFORE his killing!??
________________________

NETANYAHU
TIME OF OFFICIAL DEATH ANNOUNCEMENT AND NETANYAHU’S 1st TWEET
Charlie Kirk was shot on 10th September 2025, at approximately 8:30 PM MDT (10:30 PM EDT).
Netanyahu's tweet was made at approximately 21:21 GMT (2:21 PM EDT) on September 10, 2025, shortly after the shooting was reported. Bibi’s tweet was condemning the “murder” and describing Kirk as a "lion-hearted friend of Israel".
So Netanyahu made the first official, public response notifying the world of Kirk’s DEATH only 3 hours and 51 minutes after the shooting.

Summary:
• Netanyahu's 1st tweet condemning Kirk’s death was 3 hours and 51 minutes after the shooting.
____________________________

That’s just some ‘open’ questions that immediately came to mind.


P.S. Netanyahu posted his tweet at almost 02:00 am in the morning in Israel-time.


GROK — replying to my questions:

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's tweet condemning the "murder" was posted on X (formerly Twitter) at 3:50 p.m. MT (which corresponds to 1:50 a.m. IST the next day in Israel, accounting for the ~10-hour time difference).
The tweet read: "Charlie Kirk was murdered for speaking truth and defending freedom. A lion-hearted friend of Israel, he fought the lies and stood tall for Judeo-Christian civilization. I spoke to him only two weeks ago and invited him to Israel. Sadly, that visit will not take place. We lost an irreplaceable voice for freedom. All people of goodwill must condemn this horrific murder and demand justice for Charlie." This was Netanyahu's initial public condemnation, explicitly using the term "murdered" twice and calling for universal condemnation.
SUMMARY: Time after coroner’s declaration = approximately 20 minutes.

Official US Institution Report
The first official US institutional declaration of Charlie Kirk's death came from President Donald Trump on September 10, 2025, at 2:40 p.m. MT, via a post on Truth Social stating, "The Great, and even Legendary, Charlie Kirk, is dead".
As the sitting US President, this served as the authoritative federal confirmation, prompting flags at half-mast and a White House video address later that evening prematurely blaming "radical left" rhetoric.
The hospital (Timpanogos Regional) pronounced him dead earlier (around 1:00–2:00 p.m. MT after transport at 12:23 p.m. MT), but did not issue a public statement.
The Utah Department of Public Safety and local police gave no formal death announcement.
The FBI's initial custody reports (later retracted) were post-2:40 p.m. MT.
SUMMARY: Time after coroner pronouncement = approximately 1 hour 10 minutes.

Official Mainstream News Reports
The first official mainstream news reports confirming Charlie Kirk's death from the shooting occurred on September 10, 2025, around 2:50 p.m. MT (Mountain Time), approximately 10 minutes after President Donald Trump's announcement on Truth Social. Major outlets like ABC News, NBC News, The New York Times, and AP News entered "breaking news" mode, reporting Kirk had been pronounced dead at Timpanogos Regional Hospital in Orem, Utah, following the 12:20 p.m. MT shooting at Utah Valley University. For example, ABC News published a visual timeline at 2:40 p.m. MT referencing Trump's post, with full confirmation and details (including the neck wound from a sniper shot) in updates by 2:50 p.m. MT. Prior to this, reports focused on the shooting and Kirk's critical condition, but the death was not verified in mainstream sources until Trump's announcement triggered widespread coverage.
SUMMARY: Time after coroner pronouncement = approximately 1 hour 20 minutes.

[Scott]

Wahrheitssucher, most of your questions are good ─ although I think it has already been explained why we don't have complete answers to them yet.

I am confused by this statement of yours, however:

"Charlie Kirk was shot on 10th September 2025, at approximately 8:30 PM MDT (10:30 PM EDT)."

These must be typos. The time 8:30 AM (MDT) is when Tyler Robinson was first videotaped by doorbell cameras near the campus wearing shorts and a maroon shirt, casing the neighborhood.

He later put on pants and changed his shirt to the blue one (with the American flag and Eagle) just before the shooting, and then changed his shirt after the shooting when he ditched his rifle. In the Dairy Queen surveillance video in Orem after the shooting, Tyler was wearing pants and a maroon shirt.

There is subsequent surveillance video found of Robinson stopping at a gas station on Interstate-15 midpoint on his way back to Washington, County, Utah where he lived. The mileage between Orem, Utah and Washington, Utah (near St. George) is 262 miles via I-15.

The Kirk shot occurred at 12:23:23 AM (MDT) or 02:23:23 PM (EDT) also (18:23:23 Zulu, UTC, or GMT).

Wikipedia says that Charlie Kirk was shot at 12:23:30 PM (MDT) or (18:23:30 Z).

The exact moment of the shot has been established more closely by Gray Hughes Investigates on YouTube, who synced cellphone and other evidence to the sound of the shot and puts it at seven seconds earlier than the Wikipedia entry.

Gray Hughes has also walked and filmed all of the paths in Orem, Utah that Robinson might have taken on September 10th and collaborated with other amateur investigators, and even visited homeowners in the area and gotten copies of their doorbell surveillance cameras.

From the edge where Tyler Robinson jumped off the roof, Gray Hughes was able to photograph hand and foot prints still visible a month later with his camera mounted on a pole. The police have the roof where the shooting occurred blocked off, but the roof has common areas that are still easily accessible that Robinson likely knew about in advance if he had ever investigated attenting UVA in Orem ─ which seems likely since he did briefly attend Utah State University in Logan near the Idaho border. By the way, Utah State is where my Dad got his advanced degree in Mathematics & Statistics when he was studying to be a rocket and nuclear reliability engineer.

In the UVU surveillance video released by the FBI ─ which does not include the actual shooting, likely because that is relevant to the trial investigation and not just for the public identification of the suspect ─ the first frame of Tyler running on the Losee Center roof after the shot was fired is at 12:23:34 according to the timestamp. So Tyler was running away less than ten seconds or so after the shot was fired, waiting only to roll up the rifle in the towel that he likely rested on in the prone firing position.

I was at work at the time and just started browsing my news feeds at about 11:23 AM (MST) also 18:23:23 UTC ─ Arizona does not use Daylight Savings Time so we remain on Mountain Standard Time year-round) and I got the notification that Charlie Kirk had been shot in Utah but was apparently not dead.

I do not recall exactly the time that the news feed confirmed that he was pronounced dead by the ER staff at the hospital, but he was DOA and the news notificaion came within a half hour or so (I think) of the notification of the shooting itself.

According to the CBS News timeline:

Kirk was shot at 12:23 (MDT) and the suspect was seen jumping off that roof at 12:23 PM (MDT) or less than a minute later.

"Local FBI and police chiefs were on scene within sixteen minutes of the shooting."

The FBI offered a cash reward for information at 12:44 PM (MDT).

Video captured at 2:37 PM (MDT) "shows officers searching an area around a quarter mile north of the campus. CBS News confirmed the time using the video's metadata." (Also, many homeowners reported police and detectives searching their neighborhood with assault rifles and dogs, and there is quite a lot of video available on that.)





At 2:40 PM (MDT), President Trump posted on social media that "The Great and even Legendary Charlie Kirk is dead."

The FBI released surveillance video of the suspect the next morning (SEP 11th) just before 10 AM.

FBI Director Cash Patel and Deputy Dan Bongino arrived in Utah also the next day on 11 SEP 2025.

I'm sure that Israeli Prime Minister Bibi Netanyahoo was briefed about the Charlie Kirk assassination within an hour after it occurred. It is really not that remarkable that with the Gaza War spin that he would go into immediate damage control mode and claim Kirk as an ally rather than a critic.

Whether Charlie Kirk really was either a staunch critic or Jewish ally, I don't know, but Leftists and AntiFa have (absurdly) been calling him a "White Nationalist" for some time. (I'm a White Nationalist and Charlie Kirk never came to the meetings, LOL.)

I think Tyler Robinson in his chats/texts is correct that the police recovery of the rifle is damning and will cook his goose at his trial (DNA, electronic metadata of texts and chats, etc.). However, there is plenty of other evidence.



For the Thomas Crooks shooting of Trump last year, I would recommend the Jeff Ostroff series of YouTube video investigations.

[Wahrheitssucher]

This man [Ryne Simmons] was one of the attendees who filmed the moment Kirk was shot. He filmed it from the front. His is one of the immediately widely shared videos.
He sent it to the FBI.
He is claiming that FBI requested him to delete it from his phone as it might cause him post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD).

He didn’t think that was a genuine reason, so didn’t.
They rang him back to ask if he’d deleted it yet. He said no.
Then he later found that of all his videos just THAT ONE had been deleted.

Ask yourselves: who has the capability to access people’s phones and delete stuff?



https://www.ibtimes.co.uk/charlie-kirk- ... eo-1750195

[Wahrheitssucher]

I'm sure that Israeli Prime Minister Bibi Netanyahoo was briefed about the Charlie Kirk assassination within an hour after it occurred.

This is NOT a valid response to the incongruity I highlighted.
It’s a justification by misdirection.
Obfuscation by misrepresentation.
I referred to Netan-yahoo‘s tweet at 01:50 a.m. Israel time ONLY 20 minutes AFTER Kirk had been officially declared dead by a coroner. Netan-yahoo’s tweet [real name Benzion Mileikowsky] was the first official statement announcing Kirk was dead! And it was made at nearly 2:00 am in the morning!!!!
If you see nothing unusual in that, you are possibly a bit thick. [which I don’t think Scott is]
If you WANT to influence others to see nothing unusual in that, then you are presumably gaslighting /engaged in psy-ops for zionists.

It is really not that remarkable that with the Gaza War spin that he would go into immediate damage control mode and claim Kirk as an ally rather than a critic.

It IS “remarkable that he did that at almost 2:00 am when most normal people are deep in sleep!!! So this is further deception / obfuscation by misdirection from Scott!

Whether Charlie Kirk really was either a staunch critic or Jewish ally… I don’t know… [snip]

Yes Scott does! Everyone interested now knows.
Everyone here at this CODOH forum knows if they have been curious enough to check and if they’ve been paying attention to the conclusive EVIDENCE shared in this CODOH topic-thread.
So this appears to be another clear deceit. Presumably to protect Israel from warranted/justified suspicion.

[Scott]

Um, Charlie Kirk arrived DOA at Timpanogos Hospital in Orem, Utah at 12:23:55 PM (MDT). That is 18:23:55 UTC.

(Note , the above is just the time for DOA that I found from one source, of very few, and it seems closer to the time of the shooting than the actual hospital arrival time, which must have taken a few minutes at least. I'd say that 12:45 is more accurate for the DOA, but until I see some other sources, it's not too important. Timpanogos Hospital is about 2.5 miles North of UVU via I-15, and both venues are close to the Interstate.)

Anyway, Israel is UTC +2 (Bravo time) normally, but in the Summertime (until last Sunday, 26 OCT 2025 in fact) it was effectively UTC +3 (Charlie time).

Israel is back on Standard time now, whereas the USA ─ with the exception of Arizona, which remains on Standard time year 'round ─ will not "fall back" to Standard time until next Sunday (02 NOV 2025).

So, this time cited above is 9:23:55 PM in Israel or 21:23:55 Charlie or 18:23:55 Zulu.

In any case, it wasn't two in the morning but about nine-thirty at night or a little later when Kirk was confirmed dead. Netanyahoo's handlers probably saw it come down the news wire immediately.

Trump tweeted about Kirk's assassination at 2:40 PM (MDT) according to the CBS News timeline. I assume that Trump was in either New York or Washington, DC.

That is 4:40 PM (EDT) or 20:40 UTC. In Israel on September 10th, that would have been 23:40 C or 11:40 PM (IDT).

I don't know exactly when Natanyahoo first made made his condolences statement about the assassination or on Twitter, but you might want to double check the time stamp.

As far as your earlier point, I agree that corporate big tech social media is Orwellian.

They scrub anything within hours of it happening. Unless people saved things on a hard drive, the Cloud is probably scrubbed too because no platforms will carry edgy content.

I certainly understand how that works running message forums related to the Holocaust.

And during Covid 19, platforms would not permit discussion of the pandemic or of vaccines. Webmasters had to agree to those terms in most cases or be deplatformed, although I never would have banned vaccine or Covid discussions, regardless. It is not like I am afraid of being deplatformed. And it has certainly happened to me often enough.

I personally believe in vaccines and see nothing wrong with measels and polio vaccinations for school kiddies. I think if we do stop mandating this, I can see nothing good coming from it. We have forgotten how deadly and crippling these diseases actually were. And the idea that vaccines cause autism is completely-debunked poppycock.

Yes, it is possible to get a bad batch of a vaccine, and it has happened once or twice, but there is a far greater chance of getting the disease itself without getting vaccinated. People tend to be innumerate and irrational and emotional, which is not particularly helpful.

I think that Epistemological Nihilism, and the fact that critical-thinking is never taught anymore, is just as much of a problem as censorship.

[Wahrheitssucher]

As we previously reported, Sunday’s Charlie Kirk memorial drew an estimated 90,000 mourners to State Farm Stadium in Glendale, Arizona.

The guest of honor, of course, was Charlie’s widow, Erika Kirk…
… the event had a very different tone than the usual memorial service.

And some social media users believe aspects of the memorial were inappropriate or even offensive. Critics are calling the Charlie Kirk memorial service ‘disingenuous’ and ‘performative’.
… Erika Kirk’s portrayal of grief is disingenuous. Tears aren’t streaming down from red eyes, and it seems like makeup is still intact.

“While I understand that people grieve differently, it’s important to be honest and not pretend to be in pain.”

“I watched Erika Kirk’s speech last night with an open mind, because regardless of how anyone feels about Charlie Kirk, she has the right to grieve her husband. [But] it felt rehearsed, strategic, and honestly… promotional. Then I saw the bizarre scene where she was recorded (while wearing a mic), [supposedly] talking to Charlie Kirk in his casket. Which was then uploaded to all her social media accounts, rather than kept as a private moment. All I can say is, the grift never stops”.

https://www.thehollywoodgossip.com/2025 ... yal-title/

[HansHill]

I've been following this thread on and off out of curiosity. Wahrheitssucher; you posted 4 - 5 items about Charlie's wife Erika and I am failing to see the point here. Can you clarify what the point is being made here?

She is not sad enough? She was the killer? She is in on it? That's not really his wife? He is still alive? She's a fed? What are you getting at with these posts about her not being sad enough?

(Assume the failure to understand is on my part)

[Wahrheitssucher]

Joe Kent, a former CIA operative and Green Beret veteran, took the reins at the Counterterrorism Center in July 2025.
Recently Kent decided to dig into FBI files to uncover any foreign involvement in the killing of Charlie Kirk.

Kash Patel didn’t like that so closed down his investigation.

FBI Director Kash Patel has abruptly terminated an investigation into possible foreign involvement in the murder of conservative activist Charlie Kirk. This decision has sparked serious concerns about the bureau’s commitment to uncovering the full truth behind the case.

Joe Kent, head of the National Counterterrorism Center and trusted adviser to Tulsi Gabbard, had been reviewing FBI files to determine whether a foreign power played any role in supporting Kirk’s assassination. According to documents obtained by The Jew York Times, claim that Kent’s inquiry rattled Patel and other top DOJ officials, [and have tried to justify it by describing] it as an overstep into FBI jurisdiction and a potential disruption to the ongoing prosecution.

Patel, who was initially hailed as an agent of reform and integrity within the FBI, interpreted Kent’s probe as a direct challenge to the bureau’s handling of the case. “Mr. Patel and other senior officials believed Mr. Kent was overstepping, treading on F.B.I. responsibilities and potentially interfering with the investigation and the prosecution of the suspect, Tyler Robinson” the report continued.

The reality is more likely that zionist-stooge Patel didn’t want anyone investigating any possible ISRAELI involvement! And that is NOT because that is “interfering with the investigation” but because it would be an investigating of the FBI investigation itself, plus an investigation of the possibility that the ‘investigation’ is zionist-owned/controlled.

We should ask ourselves this:

Q. Why wouldn’t someone want an investigation of whether FBI investigators — who are currently controlling the narrative AND the ‘evidence’ — have been infiltrated by, and are working for, a foreign nation?

Q. Why would there be any fear of transparency?

Given the gravity of Charlie Kirk’s murder and its wider political implications, questions naturally arise about the FBI’s intentions and transparency. Recent investigative work by independent journalists Candace Owens, Sam Parker, and Ian Carroll has exposed troubling gaps and inconsistencies in the official narrative. Owens, in particular, has highlighted efforts by powerful interests to suppress key evidence and manage public perception surrounding the killing.

Public confidence in the FBI’s version of events has eroded significantly. To many Americans, the government’s handling of the case appears less about justice and more about orchestrating a rapid closure that covers uncomfortable truths. This case symbolizes a broader crisis of credibility in a justice system viewed increasingly as a political instrument rather than an impartial arbiter.

As Tyler Robinson remains in custody facing a possible death sentence, the public deserves clear answers: Who truly had the motive and capacity to orchestrate Charlie Kirk’s assassination? Why is credible evidence presented by independent sources being sidelined while the FBI seemingly clamps down on further inquiry? The parallels to historic government cover-ups cannot be ignored, and suspicion continues to mount that key facts are being deliberately obscured.

Increasing numbers of Americans reject the sanitized narratives promoted by the FBI and Kirk’s affiliated organizations.

With mounting contradictions and unresolved questions, this situation looks less like an investigation and more like an official smokescreen. The involvement of the FBI, DOJ, and White House in halting deeper probes only fuels the perception that what lies beneath is something the government is desperate to conceal.

The American people deserve truth and accountability — not silence and secrecy. Yet all evidence suggests the priority remains protecting reputations over uncovering the full story. It is this reality that drives growing skepticism and anger, as citizens recognize a cover-up when they see one.

This case stands as a stark warning:
trust in institutions promised to serve justice is rapidly diminishing amid fears of widespread deception and misdirection.
The imperative now is to demand transparency and resist efforts to obscure what truly happened.

https://nationalfile.com/fbi-chief-kash ... ons-mount/

[Wahrheitssucher]

…I am failing to see the point here. Can you clarify what the point is being made here?

…What are you getting at with these posts…

The content shared was NOT written by me. So I am unable to clarify the intended meaning.

In each shared post from X (twitter), the person writing attempted to make their perspective clear.
So… If you cannot understand their intended meaning, you can ask them directly. That’s the beauty of social media.

I myself think each post shared was abundantly clear.
I am surprised you couldn’t comprehend each of the “points being made” by each of them.


I shared them here because I understand this topic-thread was created to discourage people from questioning or harbouring any skepticism of the official narrative.
There are a great many people who don’t trust it, nor trust the ones creating that ‘official’ narrative, nor the people on social media promoting it.
I share their distrust.

ERIKA?
I personally thought Erika’s behaviour after Kirk’s shooting was inconsistent with a grieving wife, and was staged / was insincere. Did you watch her speech? Did you watch any of the short clips I posted?

NO BLOOD?
I also thought it deeply surprising that there was no visible sign of blood in any of the videos taken: not on the ground where Kirk fell and not on the journey with his body to the car.

DESTROYING A CRIME SCENE?
I also think it is deeply suspect that the area — which was/is a crime scene — was never fenced off and was almost immediately destroyed/renovated = tampered with.

CLOSING DOWN AN OFFICIAL INVESTIGATION INTO POSSIBLE FOREIGN INVOLVEMENT?
Don’t you think it is deeply suspect that Joe Kent’s investigation was curtailed? (see previous post)

[HansHill]

The content shared was NOT written by me. So I am unable to clarify the intended meaning.

In each shared post from X (twitter), the person writing attempted to make their perspective clear.
So… If you cannot understand their intended meaning, you can ask them directly. That’s the beauty of social media.

That's fair, however I am a Twitter refugee (due to Holocaust Revisionism) and I think I am potentially IP range banned from creating new accounts, hence asking you to explain them.

I myself think each post shared was abundantly clear.
I am surprised you couldn’t comprehend each of the “points being made” by each of them.

...
ERIKA?
I personally thought Erika’s behaviour after Kirk’s shooting was inconsistent with a grieving wife, and was staged / was insincere. Did you watch her speech? Did you watch any of the short clips I posted?

I still don't get this. What I do get, is that you are suspicious of her lack of grief / sorrow / mourning. But I don't get where you are going with this. She's a Fed? She's Mossad? She's in on the deal? Help me fill in step 2:

Step 1) Erika Kirk is behaving anomalously
Step 2) ???
Step 3) Therefore the official narrative is unsupported

[Wahrheitssucher]

I myself think each post shared was abundantly clear.
I am surprised you couldn’t comprehend each of the “points being made” by each of them.

...
ERIKA?
I personally thought Erika’s behaviour after Kirk’s shooting was inconsistent with a grieving wife, and was staged / was insincere. Did you watch her speech? Did you watch any of the short clips I posted?

I still don't get this.
What I do get, is that you are suspicious of her lack of grief / sorrow / mourning.
But I don't get where you are going with this. She's a Fed? She's Mossad? She's in on the deal? Help me fill in step 2:

Step 1) Erika Kirk is behaving anomalously
Step 2) ???
Step 3) Therefore the official narrative is unsupported

No need to go anywhere with it.
Just recognise the apparent insincerity + deception and then be content to stay with that uncertainty.

Why speculate further? I don’t think speculation is very useful if we aren’t being given all the details yet. Plus I suspect crazy speculation is desired (as I explained at the very beginning of this topic-thread).

If we want certainty then:
Step 1. be open to and aware of any incongruity, inconsistency, insincerity, suspicious behaviour, possible deceitful behaviour.
Step 2. stay with that, as the narrative develops, without any favoured conclusion.
Step 3. be open to all possibilities and collect and categorise the evidence.

SUMMARY: There are so many inconsistencies here. We don’t have to supply reasons or conclusions for them… YET! I think it’s just reasonable and helpful to notice them PLUS to bring them to the attention of others.

AND… I have some questions for you, if you’ll allow them:

Q1. Aren’t you aware of the many inconsistencies/illogicalities in the official narrative and behaviour of key players.
Q2. I still don’t know if you watched Erika’s ‘performance’ at that weird ‘memorial’ service/political rally. Did you?
Q3. Did you watch clips of her giving interviews, etc.? Did she look in grief to you?
Q4. Don’t you think her ‘performance’ at the casket with supposedly Kirk’s hand looked ‘staged’ and was not something a normal person would get filmed and put on their social media?
Q5. Have you no problem with the crime scene being ‘renovated’ = tampered with/destroyed?
Q6. Are you ok with Kash Patel terminating Joe Kent’s investigation of possible foreign involvement?
Q7. Don’t you think it is unlikely that there was no visible blood on the ground, on Kirk’s clothing, on the hands and clothing of those who lifted him and carried him?