Bischoff Letter

[ConfusedJew]

A letter, dated June 28, 1943, was sent by Karl Bischoff, the head of the Central Building Administration in Auschwitz-Birkenau, to Hans Kammler in Berlin. It summarized the ideal cremation capacity for the 52 muffles in a 24-hour period (including down time for cleaning and maintenance).

David Irving argues that the Bischoff letter was forged by the Russians to embarrass the Germans. But the Russians’ own (incorrect) figures for the number of people murdered and cremated in Auschwitz-Birkenau were four times higher than the actual death toll. Why would the Russians forge a letter that confirmed less than one-fourth of their own calculations?

There is an authentic Nazi document on the capacity of the crematoria ovens at Auschwitz-Birkenau: the Bischoff letter. The letter clearly details the Nazis’ own calculations: the ovens had the ability to burn at least 4,756 bodies in a 24-hour period. Holocaust deniers assert that the letter is a forgery, but there are critical problems with this assumption.

https://www.hdot.org/debunking-denial/a ... nts-ovens/

People here have questioned how they could have cremated so many people but they were only accounting for one crematorium. Accounting for all crematoria, you'd be able to reach a million in about 200 days and they didn't exclusively use the crematoria.

[ConfusedJew]

Here's a letter where they talk about the installation of ventilators and refer to the Crematorium II as a gas chamber rather than a morgue on timesheets.

None of you guys have clearly visited the archives to look at the primary documents. There's so much evidence here that you can't possible write off as forgeries. None of these separated people would have had the means to coordinate or even forge the same things on things as mundane as timesheets.

https://phdn.org/archives/holocaust-his ... 0371.shtml

[ConfusedJew]

I feel like I've found enough irrefutable evidence but I still want to know how you guys bury your heads in the ground like ostriches.

Overly obsessing over wrong or misleading technical details can keep you busy for quite awhile but there are so many credible rebuttals that you guys are refusing to acknowledge as real. Continuing to spread this false information causes a lot of suffering but maybe you guys are sociopaths and want to do that.

[Callafangers]

A letter, dated June 28, 1943, was sent by Karl Bischoff, the head of the Central Building Administration in Auschwitz-Birkenau, to Hans Kammler in Berlin. It summarized the ideal cremation capacity for the 52 muffles in a 24-hour period (including down time for cleaning and maintenance).

David Irving argues that the Bischoff letter was forged by the Russians to embarrass the Germans. But the Russians’ own (incorrect) figures for the number of people murdered and cremated in Auschwitz-Birkenau were four times higher than the actual death toll. Why would the Russians forge a letter that confirmed less than one-fourth of their own calculations?

There is an authentic Nazi document on the capacity of the crematoria ovens at Auschwitz-Birkenau: the Bischoff letter. The letter clearly details the Nazis’ own calculations: the ovens had the ability to burn at least 4,756 bodies in a 24-hour period. Holocaust deniers assert that the letter is a forgery, but there are critical problems with this assumption.

https://www.hdot.org/debunking-denial/a ... nts-ovens/

People here have questioned how they could have cremated so many people but they were only accounting for one crematorium. Accounting for all crematoria, you'd be able to reach a million in about 200 days and they didn't exclusively use the crematoria.

The starting point for any claimed figure is whether it was even technically possible. As for this 4,756 figure -- it was not. See section I.II.9.6 (starts on p. 346 of the PDF): https://holocausthandbooks.com/wp-conte ... -tcfoa.pdf

Summary:

• The coke consumption per corpse (e.g., 5.83 kg for Crematoria II-III and 4.37 kg for IV-V) falls far below the minimum theoretical requirements of 16 kg and 12 kg, respectively, rendering the capacities unfeasible.
• Bureaucratically, the letter contains anomalies, including unnecessary technical details about cremation capacities in a formal completion notification, while omitting required information about the hand-over negotiation for Crematorium III.
• It also uses odd terminology like "Personen" (persons) instead of "Leichen" (corpses) or "Häftlinge" (detainees) and assumes an impractical 24-hour operation, contradicting the known 12-hour operational limits of coke-fired furnaces.
• No other archival documents corroborate these figures, and the absence of follow-up correspondence with the WVHA suggests the letter (if genuine) may not have been sent or was considered erroneous, especially as it lacks a signature, possibly indicating it was a rejected draft.
• The figures also stem from a speculative 1941 report (see Mattogno's work linked above for a reference) rather than actual furnace capabilities, pointing to potential authorial incompetence, possibly by someone other than Bischoff, such as SS Sturmmann Nestripke, unfamiliar with technical and bureaucratic norms.

Also, statements shortly after the war directly from the engineers of the crematory operations at Auschwitz, Kurt Prufer and Karl Schultze:

During the interrogation of 5 March 1946, Soviet investigator Shatunovsky asked Prüfer the following question:

“How many corpses could be cremated per hour in a crematorium in Auschwitz?”

The Topf engineer answered:

“In a crematorium with five furnaces or fifteen openings (muffles), fifteen corpses were cremated in one hour.”

This corresponds to the cremation of one corpse per muffle in one hour, or a theoretical capacity of Crematoria II/III of 360 corpses each in 24 hours.

The day before, Schultze, who was perfectly familiar with the triple-muffle furnaces because he had designed and built their blowers, had stated:204

“There were five furnaces in each of the two crematoria, and three corpses were placed in each furnace, i.e. there were three openings (muffles) in each furnace. Within one hour, fifteen corpses could be cremated in a crematorium with five furnaces.”

[See p. 271: https://holocausthandbooks.com/wp-conte ... 2-aeim.pdf]

It's quite clear the 4,756 figure was not possible and that the letter quoted in this regard does not reflect actual measurements or experience, even if assumed authentic. And if it is authentic, it is far more likely a draft letter that reflects prior estimates (circa 1941) and unfounded assumptions (24-hour operation, etc.). But other discrepancies (inconsistent contents) and a lack of signature support the possibility of manipulation, when considered in the broader context ('evidence' frequently being falsified against Germany during and after the war). In any case, this possibility [of fabrication] is not necessary to rule out this document as evidence of cremation capacity outright.

[Callafangers]

Here's a letter where they talk about the installation of ventilators and refer to the Crematorium II as a gas chamber rather than a morgue on timesheets.

None of you guys have clearly visited the archives to look at the primary documents. There's so much evidence here that you can't possible write off as forgeries. None of these separated people would have had the means to coordinate or even forge the same things on things as mundane as timesheets.

https://phdn.org/archives/holocaust-his ... 0371.shtml

You and your link provide no visible document nor even quoting the original German. This is useless as we are not able to even discuss the actual language used.

Please obtain it and then scan/share here, or don't pretend that you know it can be used as evidence for your position.

[ConfusedJew]

It's on the previous page in the Pressac book. At a certain point, don't you guys ever doubt yourselves? I understand if there were a few documents or testimonies that are misleading, but you guys are jumping through hoops and bending over backwards to not accept what is blindly right in front of your faces.

https://phdn.org/archives/holocaust-his ... 0370.shtml

You have an excuse for every single piece of evidence that is almost entirely clear to most people who look at it.

[ConfusedJew]

So many different testimonies point back to this letter which shows that they burnt multiple bodies in a muffle at the same time and ran the ovens around the clock. It's almost a statistical impossibility for that many random people and sources to be wrong or conspiratorially lying, especially when they were totally disconnected.

I really don't know how you can make good decisions in your life if that is how you misinterpret that much strong evidence.

[Callafangers]

So many different testimonies point back to this letter which shows that they burnt multiple bodies in a muffle at the same time and ran the ovens around the clock. It's almost a statistical impossibility for that many random people and sources to be wrong or conspiratorially lying, especially when they were totally disconnected.

I really don't know how you can make good decisions in your life if that is how you misinterpret that much strong evidence.

No, "so many testimonies" do not, especially if we're focusing on any contemporary wartime statements. Put up or shut up, you make these claims with no evidence based on your ignorance of, well... everything.

And don't talk to me about "decisions", ConfusedJew. You are a Jewish caricature in-action, lying incessantly on an internet forum to cover for your tribe's repulsive behavior as a collective.

[Callafangers]

It's on the previous page in the Pressac book. At a certain point, don't you guys ever doubt yourselves? I understand if there were a few documents or testimonies that are misleading, but you guys are jumping through hoops and bending over backwards to not accept what is blindly right in front of your faces.

https://phdn.org/archives/holocaust-his ... 0370.shtml

You have an excuse for every single piece of evidence that is almost entirely clear to most people who look at it.

Wow and it appears that you have confirmed that the alleged use of "gas chamber" and "undressing room" on the previous citation you provided were not actually quotes from the document at all but, rather, Pressac's substitution of terms:

Messing worked successively on the following tasks [the terms have been simplified and "Leichenkeller 1 and 2" have been replaced by “gas chamber” and “undressing room” respectively, the terms designating their true function]:

Are we on the same page here, ConfusedJew?

[ConfusedJew]

So many different testimonies point back to this letter which shows that they burnt multiple bodies in a muffle at the same time and ran the ovens around the clock. It's almost a statistical impossibility for that many random people and sources to be wrong or conspiratorially lying, especially when they were totally disconnected.

I really don't know how you can make good decisions in your life if that is how you misinterpret that much strong evidence.

No, "so many testimonies" do not, especially if we're focusing on any contemporary wartime statements. Put up or shut up, you make these claims with no evidence based on your ignorance of, well... everything.

And don't talk to me about "decisions", ConfusedJew. You are a Jewish caricature in-action, lying incessantly on an internet forum to cover for your tribe's repulsive behavior as a collective.

I haven't lied about anything but I don't believe that you actually believe what you are saying. I could list off so many testimonies that corroborate the Bischoff letter but you'll make up some other dumb excuse.

They did not coordinate. It is almost impossible for so many independent sources to converge to the same story which isn't that surprising because everybody knows the Holocaust is as true as historical narratives come. You guys are in the weirdest echo chamber I have ever encountered on the internet.

[ConfusedJew]

The document explicitly references the "undressing cellar" (Auskleidekeller), indicating spaces where victims disrobed. Why would anybody need to disrobe to enter a morgue? They would already be dead!!! Literally makes no sense!!!

The timesheets of Messing, a Topf & Sons fitter, detail the installation of ventilation and air extraction systems for Leichenkeller 1, which were critical for removing toxic Zyklon-B (HCN) gas after gassings. The telegram from February 26, 1943 (Document 28), requesting 10 gas detectors, further supports this, as these devices were likely used to measure residual HCN levels in Leichenkeller 1, confirming its use as a gas chamber. The need for 10 gas detectors would have been inconsistent with morgue functions but critical for gas chambers to ensure safe entry after gassing.

The ventilation systems installed were far more robust than typical morgue requirements. Morgues do not need rapid air exchange or specialized gas detectors for toxic substances like HCN. The systems in Leichenkeller 1 were designed to extract large quantities of toxic gas quickly, a necessity for gas chambers where Zyklon-B was used for mass murder.

The high-capacity fans, butterfly valves, and gas detectors described are disproportionate to morgue requirements and specifically suited to managing toxic gases in a sealed chamber.

The presence of gas detectors and the rapid timeline for testing and operation (March 10–13, 1943) strongly indicate that the system was designed for homicidal gassing. A morgue would not require such urgency or specialized equipment.

You are right though that Pressac chose to use the word gas chamber but he didn't replace the word for undressing cellar.

I guess you could say that timesheet is yet another forgery or fake though like every other damning piece of evidence.

[ConfusedJew]

The Weimar State Archives hold the records of J.A. Topf & Sons, including internal company documents related to their work at Auschwitz. Pressac’s work cites the archive (Bestand Topf & Sons No. 2/555) for other documents, such as Ludwig Topf Jr.’s suicide note and records related to Kurt Prüfer’s arrest. Schultze’s report, as an internal Topf & Sons document, is likely part of this collection.

Researchers can contact the Weimar State Archives directly to request access to the Topf & Sons collection. Access may require:

A formal research request outlining the purpose and specific documents sought. In-person visits or coordination with archivists for digitized copies, if available. Knowledge of German, as many documents are in the original language.

[Callafangers]

I haven't lied about anything but I don't believe that you actually believe what you are saying. I could list off so many testimonies that corroborate the Bischoff letter but you'll make up some other dumb excuse.

You're not even trying, ConfusedJew. The letter describes a technical impossibility. Do you know what that means? That means that your witnesses, if they claim this, must necessarily be lying. If you have witnesses who claim "pigs can fly", it doesn't matter how many witnesses. The technical feasibility trumps any such considerations, 100%.

In addition, there is reason to cast doubt upon testimonies post-war by Jews (and Allies) who benefit from lying or from Germans whose wives and children were under their enemies' control. Is this the 'corroboration' you had in mind?

They did not coordinate. It is almost impossible for so many independent sources to converge to the same story which isn't that surprising because everybody knows the Holocaust is as true as historical narratives come. You guys are in the weirdest echo chamber I have ever encountered on the internet.

No, it is not "almost impossible" for people either on the same side of a war or under the thumb of their enemies to find a common thread in how they tell a story.

You pretend to be "confused", you pretend to think we are "weird" here, etc. -- but the truth is, you're framing it however you can to cast suspicion, doubt, disgust, etc. upon revisionism, since any of those are helpful to achieve your aim of securing maximum Jewish interests. The truth apparently has no influence in what you say, unless by mere circumstance or convenience.

This was proven from your "day one" on this forum (exposed and discussed here: https://www.codohforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=339 ). You presented yourself as a "sincere, open-minded" Jew, just here to raise serious questions out of honest curiosity for the topic in general. But it quickly became clear you had ulterior motives that are transparent to any sincere person visiting this forum.

The document explicitly references the "undressing cellar" (Auskleidekeller), indicating spaces where victims disrobed. Why would anybody need to disrobe to enter a morgue? They would already be dead!!! Literally makes no sense!!!

CJ, the term you quoted (or claimed to), specifically, was "gas chamber"... so where is it? You said:

Here's a letter where they talk about the installation of ventilators and refer to the Crematorium II as a gas chamber rather than a morgue on timesheets.

So what in the fresh hell are you talking about, here? Did they say "gas chamber"? Or did they only mention a cellar for "undressing" (an act that most certainly can pertain to corpses, removing their clothing [perhaps for delousing or immediate burning]), directly adjacent to explicitly using the term "C.Cellar [corpse cellar]" and not the term "gas chamber"?

Do you suppose they were instructed to use code language, or weren't they? Because the use of "corpse cellar" explicitly supports the revisionist position that your alleged 'gas chamber' was actually a morgue.

The 'gas detectors' nonsense has already been covered by Mattogno (see p. 86-88, https://holocausthandbooks.com/wp-conte ... aootgc.pdf):

• The Feb. 1943 telegram came from the Auschwitz Construction Office to Topf (a furnace maker) and involved the camp’s furnace tech, Rudolf Jahrling.
• They asked for 10 testers -- exactly matching the number of flues in Crematoria II & III -- likely to check CO and CO2 levels for better crematoria efficiency.
• Since 1941, the SS physician handled Zyklon B disinfestation and HCN testing kits from Tesch & Stabenow (thus, already available on-site or through proper channels), so it is impractical and senseless that the Construction Office would now order these from Topf.
• Topf’s reply about hunting for HCN detectors clashes with the telegram’s urgent tone ("send immediately as agreed") and appears to be a mix-up or a fake.

Overall, this order fits furnace upkeep way better than 'gassing'. Quantity of items ordered (matching the number of flues), parties involved (furnace builders and technicians), overall circumstances and precedent (cyanide tests already available), and inconsistencies in tone and context in the telegram all favor the revisionist position.

The ventilation systems installed were far more robust than typical morgue requirements.

Do you care to elaborate on this, ConfusedJew? How many air exchanges per hour would be required for this room's potential use as a homicidal gas chamber with the witness timelines as alleged? And how many did the ventilation systems installed entail?

You have not upheld any of your points thus far on this forum. I do plan one day to quantify just how many claims you originally stated with confidence and which were totally eviscerated or invalidated thereafter. To avoid further embarrassment, you may want to adjust your tone a bit while presenting 'evidence'.

[Wetzelrad]

A letter, dated June 28, 1943, was sent by Karl Bischoff, the head of the Central Building Administration in Auschwitz-Birkenau, to Hans Kammler in Berlin. It summarized the ideal cremation capacity for the 52 muffles in a 24-hour period (including down time for cleaning and maintenance).

On the one hand, it's good that you're finally using material written by human beings. A shame that you're trusting Deborah Lipstadt, of all people, but this is an improvement over AI. On the other hand, you are rather liberally copying and pasting her article without anything like a quotation mark which makes for confusing reading.

Contrary to what's written there, the Bischoff Letter includes no allowance for down time, cleaning, or maintenance. The figures represent 24 uninterrupted hours of operation. That is a blatant lie on Lipstadt's part.

David Irving argues that the Bischoff letter was forged by the Russians to embarrass the Germans.

I see no evidence that David Irving ever argued this letter was "forged by the Russians to embarass the Germans". He did challenge the document's validity over a number of different issues that it was found to have, issues that Lipstadt's team were unable to fully explain. His argument did come with the implication of forgery, but embarassment had nothing to do with it. You can read the transcript here:
https://www.hdot.org/day08/#d_8_15419

Irving did also make separate arguments about this document. He was not singular to just the forgery interpretation.

But the Russians’ own (incorrect) figures for the number of people murdered and cremated in Auschwitz-Birkenau were four times higher than the actual death toll. Why would the Russians forge a letter that confirmed less than one-fourth of their own calculations?

It is a self-defeating question to ask why the letter would be forged in an argument where you are using the letter as evidence. Worse than that, Lipstadt argues that, because the Soviets lied about the cremation capacity, with numbers supposedly as high as 19,000 per day, that we should choose to trust a lower exaggeration which also arises from Soviet custody. This is very foolish. The logical reaction to have when someone is caught lying is to be more skeptical of other things they say.

In reality the false cremation figures go much further than even Lipstadt's legal counsel knew, with witnesses claiming cremation capacities per oven muffle of as little as 1 per hour to as high as 31 per hour, and the Soviets calculating as high as 36 per hour. You don't have to have any technical expertise at all to recognize that these numbers were invented with reckless disregard for the truth.
https://holocaustencyclopedia.com/manip ... anda/1743/

Callafangers has already given a number of reasons the Bischoff Letter is unreliable, reasons acknowledged by people much more serious than you. I think more issues could be raised, but it's unnecessary since you are totally incapable to respond to what's already there.

People here have questioned how they could have cremated so many people but they were only accounting for one crematorium.

Who? Don't argue against a strawman. Quote what they said specifically.

[Wetzelrad]

The need for 10 gas detectors would have been inconsistent with morgue functions but critical for gas chambers to ensure safe entry after gassing.

What a fascinating argument. So in your view the vast majority of the alleged Zyklon gassings were impossible because they were all missing this "critical" component. Well done.