Holocaust Revisionism vs. Flat-Earth Theory

[Callafangers]

I am also interested in Flat Earthers. I watched a documentary on it and I would debate a Flat Earther in person but I have less of a personal interest in it.

Every now and then, a confused Jew (or whoever) tries to suggest a similarity between what they would call "Holocaust Denial" and what might be called "Flat Earth Theory". A few things to address on this:

• There are no systems in-place overtly and indisputably aimed at censoring or attacking the personal or financial well-being of flat-earthers. All of the repression they have experienced seems solely due to ridicule, dismissal, and embarrassment -- demonstrably not the case with Holocaust revisionism, where even sharing one's favorable opinion on this topic can be job-threatening or worse.
• Flat Earth Theory is demonstrably false -- demonstrated centuries ago (and at any time) in the fact that there is no cohesive, complete model of a flat Earth that simultaneously explains all of the accepted phenomena (tides, seasons, hemispheric differences in the north vs. south, storm patterns, eclipses, geological activity such as earthquakes/volcanoes, and much more). All of these elements are explained simultaneously and within the same model, with the accepted heliocentric model of our solar system and of a sphere (oblate ellipsoid) Earth. All of the supposed anomalies (100% of them, without exception) proposed by flat-earthers have been conclusively shown as false (or at least as baseless conjecture), which is why it is seldom the case that any two flat-earthers support the same model or even make the same arguments.
• Flat-earthers are regularly demolished in debates, e.g. here:
  
  
  
  This is compared to debate against Revisionists which go unfavorably for the establishment (exterminationists) so often that organizations like CODOH have to be created just to promote the ability for such debates to occur. Here's a recent example:
  
  
  https://germarrudolf.com/2025/01/germar ... elds-show/

Overall, only the most ignorant or dishonest kind of people would claim or imply that there is a common thread between Holocaust revisionism and Flat Earth Theory.

[ConfusedJew]

I am also interested in Flat Earthers. I watched a documentary on it and I would debate a Flat Earther in person but I have less of a personal interest in it.

Every now and then, a confused Jew (or whoever) tries to suggest a similarity between what they would call "Holocaust Denial" and what might be called "Flat Earth Theory". A few things to address on this:

• There are no systems in-place overtly and indisputably aimed at censoring or attacking the personal or financial well-being of flat-earthers. All of the repression they have experienced seems solely due to ridicule, dismissal, and embarrassment -- demonstrably not the case with Holocaust revisionism, where even sharing one's favorable opinion on this topic can be job-threatening or worse.
• Flat Earth Theory is demonstrably false -- demonstrated centuries ago (and at any time) in the fact that there is no cohesive, complete model of a flat Earth that simultaneously explains all of the accepted phenomena (tides, seasons, hemispheric differences in the north vs. south, storm patterns, eclipses, geological activity such as earthquakes/volcanoes, and much more). All of these elements are explained simultaneously and within the same model, with the accepted heliocentric model of our solar system and of a sphere (oblate ellipsoid) Earth. All of the supposed anomalies (100% of them, without exception) proposed by flat-earthers have been conclusively shown as false (or at least as baseless conjecture), which is why it is seldom the case that any two flat-earthers support the same model or even make the same arguments.
  
  Overall, only the most ignorant or dishonest kind of people would claim or imply that there is a common thread between Holocaust revisionism and Flat Earth Theory.

The two movements are similar in that both are wildly unconventional beliefs that the vast majority of humans reject.

A lot of Holocaust denial is censored or suppressed as misinformation which is partly why I went out of my way to figure out what was going on in that movement.

The vast majority of humans think that the Holocaust is demonstrably false. There are so many eyewitness testimonies in addition to other pieces of evidence that so many people would never doubt but apparently most of the people on here doubt it.

As long as disagreement is well intentioned and sincere, I think it could do a lot of harm to censor it but this brings me back me Alex Jones.

When he claimed that the Sandy Hook children were crisis actors, do you think that he actually believed what he was saying and do you think his intentions were good in spreading those ideas?

If somebody spread false information about your family, would you want to be able to sue or suppress that? Would it matter to you if the person legitimately thought your family was lying about something big?

I'm not sure where to draw the lines with respect to free speech. Are you all free speech absolutists? Do you think the government has a role in criminalizing fraud or commercial deception?

[Callafangers]

As long as disagreement is well intentioned and sincere, I think it could do a lot of harm to censor it but this brings me back me Alex Jones.

When he claimed that the Sandy Hook children were crisis actors, do you think that he actually believed what he was saying and do you think his intentions were good in spreading those ideas?

If somebody spread false information about your family, would you want to be able to sue or suppress that? Would it matter to you if the person legitimately thought your family was lying about something big?

I'm not sure where to draw the lines with respect to free speech. Are you all free speech absolutists? Do you think the government has a role in criminalizing fraud or commercial deception?

Funny that you have brought up Alex Jones and Sandy Hook more than once at this forum. The thing is, Alex Jones has run cover for Jewish misbehavior for at least the last decade. His wife is Jewish and he is a central figure in the media. Above all else, his entire recent lawsuits debacle has seemed to be an attack on free speech in America. The goal is to portray the notion that there is some speech that is 'so harmful' as to warrant legal consequences, with Jones' situation entering the public consciousness as such.

See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psycholog ... ed_States)

Not surprisingly, Jones continues to live a lavish life despite supposedly facing billions in court-ordered compensation to Sandy Hook families. He isn't living on the streets -- it doesn't appear he's endured any real consequences at all... which is exactly what one would expect from someone who is doing what Jews want.

But hey, perhaps this is more coincidence, just like the many 'confessing Nazis' at the Nuremberg trials getting off relatively easy... We shouldn't trust pattern recognition at all.

[AreYouSirius]

The vast majority of humans think that the Holocaust is demonstrably false.

I knew that revisionism & accurate historical analysis of the Holocaust has been picking up steam—but wow I didn’t realize that the majority of humans think that the Holocaust is demonstrably false.

[Nessie]

I am also interested in Flat Earthers. I watched a documentary on it and I would debate a Flat Earther in person but I have less of a personal interest in it.

Every now and then, a confused Jew (or whoever) tries to suggest a similarity between what they would call "Holocaust Denial" and what might be called "Flat Earth Theory". A few things to address on this:

• There are no systems in-place overtly and indisputably aimed at censoring or attacking the personal or financial well-being of flat-earthers. All of the repression they have experienced seems solely due to ridicule, dismissal, and embarrassment -- demonstrably not the case with Holocaust revisionism, where even sharing one's favorable opinion on this topic can be job-threatening or worse.

If an academic started to teach the earth is flat, as part of a university course, they would soon find themselves ostracised and even out of a job. I suspect even school teachers would find themselves in trouble.

[*] Flat Earth Theory is demonstrably false -- demonstrated centuries ago (and at any time) in the fact that there is no cohesive, complete model of a flat Earth that simultaneously explains all of the accepted phenomena (tides, seasons, hemispheric differences in the north vs. south, storm patterns, eclipses, geological activity such as earthquakes/volcanoes, and much more). All of these elements are explained simultaneously and within the same model, with the accepted heliocentric model of our solar system and of a sphere (oblate ellipsoid) Earth. All of the supposed anomalies (100% of them, without exception) proposed by flat-earthers have been conclusively shown as false (or at least as baseless conjecture), which is why it is seldom the case that any two flat-earthers support the same model or even make the same arguments.

Holocaust denial, or so-called revisionism, is demonstrably false, but like flat earthers, they are not swayed by evidence, or logic.

[*] Flat-earthers are regularly demolished in debates, e.g. here:

Only so-called revisionists, do not think that they have been demolished in the various debates.

This is compared to debate against Revisionists which go unfavorably for the establishment (exterminationists) so often that organizations like CODOH have to be created just to promote the ability for such debates to occur. Here's a recent example:


https://germarrudolf.com/2025/01/germar ... elds-show/[/list]

Overall, only the most ignorant or dishonest kind of people would claim or imply that there is a common thread between Holocaust revisionism and Flat Earth Theory.

Wrong, they are comparable and examples of how some people can be surprisingly easily hoaxed and convinced about something blatantly impossible.

[borjastick]

A couple of points if I may. Alex Jones was very interesting some ten or more years back, he produced quality theories and made good programmes to illustrate his points. His hundred words a minute style was annoying but somewhat fun. Then the Boston marathon bombings happened and he went off on one screaming and shouting about it being staged and crisis actors etc. But he made a couple of big mistakes and simple errors in one of his films which even I could see were wrong and as such to me at least he lost all credibility.

The other point I would make is that in my view and experience most holocaust revisionists are not followers of other great conspiracy theories such as 911, Bigfoot, Sandy Hook etc. We tend to genuinely believe what we know about the holocaust and don't engage in all the crap that is spouted on 911 etc. Correct me if I am wrong please.

[Callafangers]

The other point I would make is that in my view and experience most holocaust revisionists are not followers of other great conspiracy theories such as 911, Bigfoot, Sandy Hook etc. We tend to genuinely believe what we know about the holocaust and don't engage in all the crap that is spouted on 911 etc. Correct me if I am wrong please.

Discussions of the technical and historical events of 9/11 are in no way whatsoever comparable to theories about Bigfoot or UFOs, etc.; 9/11 is an historical event, much more similar to the Holocaust than to Bigfoot. While I would say discussions about other complex topics in history may be generally beyond the scope of this forum, I think Holocaust revisionism overall is about evidence and reason, which might overlap with certain narratives if and when they, too, align with these principles and especially when aligning with particular details like perpetrator networks, governments, etc. If someone wishes to make the case that any 'conspiracy theory' is in fact aligned with evidence and reason, I'd be curious to know it, but most have shown to be false and, well... unreasonable. One of a few I would make a clear exception for is 9/11 as I have spent many years investigating this and it is what eventually led me to openness in questioning the Holocaust to begin with (first realizing Zionist-Jewish hands behind 9/11 made me ask, "well then if they're rewriting history now, I wonder if they've done this before...?"). All of this could take us far off-course from focus on the Holocaust, in any case, so I think we'd agree it's best to keep such aberrant discussions limited. I only raised the topic of "Flat Earth" on this particular thread as I have seen this comparison of Holocaust revisionists to flat-earthers and found it worth highlighting the differences, just for the record (along with any appropriate feedback/discussion others might like to add).

[Wahrheitssucher]

I am also interested in Flat Earthers.
…I would debate a Flat Earther in person..

Every now and then, a confused Jew (or whoever) tries to suggest a similarity between what they would call "Holocaust Denial" and what might be called "Flat Earth Theory".

Overall, only the most ignorant or dishonest kind of people would claim or imply that there is a common thread between Holocaust revisionism and Flat Earth Theory.

Exactly!

[Nessie]

Thinking it is possible to hoax the murder of millions of Jews, is on a par with thinking the earth is flat.

[Keen]

Wrong, they are comparable and examples of how some people can be surprisingly easily hoaxed and convinced about something blatantly impossible.

Isn't it funny, there's more evidence that the earth is flat than there is for the existence of "huge mass graves" at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II.

[Keen]

Thinking it is possible to hoax the murder of millions of Jews, is on a par with thinking the earth is flat.

Speaking of hoaxes Nessie:

It is alleged in orthodox historiography that; during WW II, the bodies and burnt remains of hundreds upon hundreds of thousands of jews were buried in numerous “huge mass graves” at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II. However, despite all the deceptive allegations to the contrary, the truth is, the largest (in terms of quantity of remains) of the one hundred graves / cremation pits that are fraudulently alleged to have been “scientifically proven” to currently exist at these five sites, in which verified human remains have been tangibly located via bona fide, verifiably honest and conclusively documented archaeology, contained the remains of -

ONLY FIVE PEOPLE.

http://thisisaboutscience.com/

[Nessie]

What puts Holocaust revisionism/denial on a par with flat earthers, is its inability to evidence that there were millions of Jews, the Nazis had arrested during the war, still alive in camps and ghettos in 1944 and liberated in 1945. So many people would have left a lot of evidence and instead, there is none.

So-called revisionists just do not think through what they argue as they ignore the conclusion of their argument, since it does not support that argument.

[Callafangers]

So many people would have left a lot of evidence and instead, there is none.

Left evidence doing what, exactly? We can speculate, just like how you speculate as to why millions of Jews or any humans' worth of remains aren't found under Sobibor, Belzec, Treblinka, Chelmno, and Auschwitz-Birkenau combined.

We can speculate that Jews were doing something other than just scheming, hiding and assimilating, emigrating abroad, freezing, starving, rotting away, or getting shot behind the Iron Curtain, just like countless thousands (millions?) of others who also more or less 'vanished' there.

We can assume Jews and their communist networks were disconnected from postwar 'denazification' efforts and awareness of the role of a supposed 'millions of missing Jews' in that narrative and would prefer instead to be documented as "found" rather than "gassed".

We can speculate that someone should/would have been looking for a particular set of displaced Jews postwar and documenting their timelines and travels. We can assume there were no Jews who might have contradicted your narrative, had they been asked 60 years ago while they were still alive.

We can pretend your pool of witnesses is honest (or at least mostly so) and that wartime liars suddenly became interested in universal truth and that their having literally conquered the world is totally inconsequential in being able to shape its narratives thereafter.

We can pretend to believe that despite all of the liars we know exist, not a single one of them ever made it into the historical or postwar trial archives to meddle with the record, for better or worse.

We can do all of this assumption, speculation, etc. and maybe then do you have a point.

Or let's just keep it real: you can say nothing of the 'people who would have left a lot of evidence', given that you haven't found them -- and not finding them much better reflects movement than 'extermination'.

You need them to be buried under Treblinka, though... because how else can you face your son at his bar mitzvah and tell him it'll be easy to keep swindling the goyim?