The CODOH Revisionist Forum

Stubble wrote: ↑Fri Apr 04, 2025 5:11 pm

Nessie wrote: ↑Fri Apr 04, 2025 3:40 pm

If 4-5 corpses take 30 minutes total, that’s 6-7.5 minutes each

If 4-5 corpses are put in an oven and left for 30 minutes, before more corpses are put into the oven, then those corpses have all spent 30 minutes in the oven, not 6-7.5 minutes each.

If 4 or 5 corpses are put into a cremation oven, it takes 4 or 5 times as long to complete its operation.

/shrug

If 1 corpse takes 1 hour (it takes about an hour give or take), then 4 bodies will take four hours. Period.

Go talk to a cremation technician.

Not if you add more fuel to maintain the internal temperature.

Stubble wrote: ↑Fri Apr 04, 2025 5:11 pm

Nessie wrote: ↑Fri Apr 04, 2025 3:40 pm

If 4-5 corpses take 30 minutes total, that’s 6-7.5 minutes each

If 4-5 corpses are put in an oven and left for 30 minutes, before more corpses are put into the oven, then those corpses have all spent 30 minutes in the oven, not 6-7.5 minutes each.

If 4 or 5 corpses are put into a cremation oven, it takes 4 or 5 times as long to complete its operation.

/shrug

If 1 corpse takes 1 hour (it takes about an hour give or take), then 4 bodies will take four hours. Period.

Go talk to a cremation technician.

Tauber said "In continuous operation, we could burn two charges per hour.". A charge was 4-5 corpses.

In the next sentence he states "According to the regulations, were supposed to charge the muffles every half hour.". So, 4-5 corpses were put into the oven and then, half an hour later, another 4-5 corpses were put in. That means each corpse was in the oven for at least 30 minutes and since Tauber does not say the first charge was removed to put in the second, it was longer than half an hour.

In the next sentence he states "Ober Capo August explained to us that, according to the calculations and plans for this crematorium, 5 to 7 minutes was allowed to burn one corpse in a muffle.". That is a calculation which is an average of the 4-5 in 30 minutes, but the actual average of 4 or 5 corpses in for 30 minutes, is 30 minutes per corpse, as each corpse is in the oven for 30 minutes. So, it is not clear what the calculation was for, as the ovens were not used for one corpse at a time, they were used for 4 to 5.

Tauber's two charges per hour, so each corpse is in for at least 30 minutes, makes more sense that one corpse in 5 to 7 minutes, because the ovens were proposed for multiple corpse cremations rather than single, witnesses describe multiple corpse cremations rather than single and one corpse in 5 to 7 minutes is not possible.

Revisionists cherry-pick the 5 to 7 minutes, ignore it is a "calculation" by a Capo and it is not the time the corpses were in the ovens according to Tauber.

bombsaway wrote: ↑Fri Apr 04, 2025 5:30 pm

Stubble wrote: ↑Fri Apr 04, 2025 5:11 pm

Nessie wrote: ↑Fri Apr 04, 2025 3:40 pm

If 4-5 corpses are put in an oven and left for 30 minutes, before more corpses are put into the oven, then those corpses have all spent 30 minutes in the oven, not 6-7.5 minutes each.

If 4 or 5 corpses are put into a cremation oven, it takes 4 or 5 times as long to complete its operation.

/shrug

If 1 corpse takes 1 hour (it takes about an hour give or take), then 4 bodies will take four hours. Period.

Go talk to a cremation technician.

Not if you add more fuel to maintain the internal temperature.

Go ask your ai to explain this to you, that's not how fuel of throughput work.

Stubble wrote: ↑Fri Apr 04, 2025 8:59 pm

bombsaway wrote: ↑Fri Apr 04, 2025 5:30 pm

Stubble wrote: ↑Fri Apr 04, 2025 5:11 pm
If 4 or 5 corpses are put into a cremation oven, it takes 4 or 5 times as long to complete its operation.

/shrug

If 1 corpse takes 1 hour (it takes about an hour give or take), then 4 bodies will take four hours. Period.

Go talk to a cremation technician.

Not if you add more fuel to maintain the internal temperature.

Go ask your ai to explain this to you, that's not how fuel of throughput work.

Sorry, I meant to respond to this. We can debate the physics if you like.

https://g.co/gemini/share/85e684e78330

You and your ai both misunderstand something called 'capacity'. Both the flue and the fire box are finite.

You actually polluted your AI's answer with your framing.

Call your local crematoria and ask them about 'the physics'.

Stubble wrote: ↑Sun Apr 06, 2025 5:37 pm You and your ai both misunderstand something called 'capacity'. Both the flue and the fire box are finite.

You actually polluted your AI's answer with your framing.

Call your local crematoria and ask them about 'the physics'.

It would seem the assumption you are making is that the chambers were designed for use similar to how normal crematoriums function. That is, one body per chamber, time isn't an issue, full heat up and cool down as part of the cycle.

https://g.co/gemini/share/f2b869372fdd

So with increased flue and fire rate it would be possible to get higher rate of water evaporation / burn.

You understand that the size of the cope, the muffles, the flue, the gasifier, the fire box, these are known quantities.

There are books on this stuff. You could read one.

Furthermore, how do you gasify more coal faster with a fixed throughput? I mean, the thing is designed to do as it does.

As a bit of a case in point, what happened when they put 2 bodies in 1 muffle? You are just going to ignore this testimony? Because so many others say 'we put 8 bodies on the litter', or what?

bombsaway wrote: ↑Sun Apr 06, 2025 8:35 pmIt would seem the assumption you are making is that the chambers were designed for use similar to how normal crematoriums function. That is, one body per chamber, time isn't an issue, full heat up and cool down as part of the cycle.

I don't see any of that in his post. His point seems to be that cremation ovens have a maximum throughput.

In the same way that I wouldn't expect a fast cooking time from my home oven if I stuffed it full of pies, I also would not expect an oven designed to cremate a single body to cremate multiple bodies in the same time.

As for coke. We know that Crema II had a coke throughput of 35 kg/hr per hearth. With 2 hearths for every 3 muffles, and with each cremation requiring 30 kg of coke, this allowed for on average 2.33 bodies to be burned in one hour in one muffle if they could be fit in there. For a max throughput of 11.67 bodies/hour for the building.

Stubble wrote: ↑Sun Apr 06, 2025 10:11 pm You understand that the size of the cope, the muffles, the flue, the gasifier, the fire box, these are known quantities.

There are books on this stuff. You could read one.

Furthermore, how do you gasify more coal faster with a fixed throughput? I mean, the thing is designed to do as it does.

As a bit of a case in point, what happened when they put 2 bodies in 1 muffle? You are just going to ignore this testimony? Because so many others say 'we put 8 bodies on the litter', or what?

For the Birkenau crema? Please provide this information.

Wetzelrad wrote: ↑Sun Apr 06, 2025 11:30 pm In the same way that I wouldn't expect a fast cooking time from my home oven if I stuffed it full of pies, I also would not expect an oven designed to cremate a single body to cremate multiple bodies in the same time.

You are saying that if I turn my oven up and try to cook 4 pies at 400 degrees, it will take 4x the amount of time as it would to cook one? This is easily testable.

https://armreg.co.uk/product/the-cremat ... 3-volumes/

Also, your pizza analogy isn't analogous to the situation, you would require a better analog.

You need to figure out a way to load the oven to 80-100% of it's capacity, then load it with 4x that and see if it functions correctly.

I noticed you failed to address the testimony about what happened when 2 bodies were loaded through 1 muffle in Krema II.

If you don't like Mattogno's books, his source material is also available, so, you could get the information from the horses mouth if you were so inclined.

Stubble wrote: ↑Mon Apr 07, 2025 1:44 am https://armreg.co.uk/product/the-cremat ... 3-volumes/

Also, your pizza analogy isn't analogous to the situation, you would require a better analog.

You need to figure out a way to load the oven to 80-100% of it's capacity, then load it with 4x that and see if it functions correctly.

I noticed you failed to address the testimony about what happened when 2 bodies were loaded through 1 muffle in Krema II.

If you don't like Mattogno's books, his source material is also available, so, you could get the information from the horses mouth if you were so inclined.

If you've gone through this data, just quote from the documents. Until you've presented them, this is an unknown to me. I'm not going to look because frankly I don't have the time nor inclination to make your arguments for you.

Then we are at an impasse, I'm not inclined to explain it to you like you are 5 and spoon feed you only to hear in the end from you 'it was possible because it happened'. Ultimately that's what will transpire.

Even your ai is telling you 'he's right', yet on you plow.

/shrug

Regardless, there are threads for this line of discourse anyhow and you could visit any of them rather than attempting to derail yet another thread with an off topic journey.

https://www.codohforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=171

Seriously, just pick one of the cremation threads Bombsaway. Pick one.

Stubble wrote: ↑Mon Apr 07, 2025 2:14 am Then we are at an impasse, I'm not inclined to explain it to you like you are 5 and spoon feed you only to hear in the end from you 'it was possible because it happened'. Ultimately that's what will transpire.

Even your ai is telling you 'he's right', yet on you plow.

/shrug

Regardless, there are threads for this line of discourse anyhow and you could visit any of them rather than attempting to derail yet another thread with an off topic journey.

https://www.codohforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=171

Seriously, just pick one of the cremation threads Bombsaway. Pick one.

You don't have to explain anything. Quote from the German documents that indicate capacity. Make a new thread for this if you want, it's super useful information.

We also know that it's likely the crema were run beyond spec. According to orthodoxy some of them broke down and weren't used, with a substantial portion of the cremations happening outside in the trenches.

" 'it was possible because it happened'. Ultimately that's what will transpire."

is this what happened the last time we talked, about the exhaust?

“You are saying that if I turn my oven up and try to cook 4 pies at 400 degrees, it will take 4x the amount of time as it would to cook one? This is easily testable”.

It won't take the same amount of time to roast one. But that's what the Sonderkommando maintain in order to reach Bischoff's 4,756 bodies per day.

bombsaway wrote: ↑Mon Apr 07, 2025 2:23 am

Stubble wrote: ↑Mon Apr 07, 2025 2:14 am Then we are at an impasse, I'm not inclined to explain it to you like you are 5 and spoon feed you only to hear in the end from you 'it was possible because it happened'. Ultimately that's what will transpire.

Even your ai is telling you 'he's right', yet on you plow.

/shrug

Regardless, there are threads for this line of discourse anyhow and you could visit any of them rather than attempting to derail yet another thread with an off topic journey.

https://www.codohforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=171

Seriously, just pick one of the cremation threads Bombsaway. Pick one.

You don't have to explain anything. Quote from the German documents that indicate capacity. Make a new thread for this if you want, it's super useful information.

We also know that it's likely the crema were run beyond spec. According to orthodoxy some of them broke down and weren't used, with a substantial portion of the cremations happening outside in the trenches.

" 'it was possible because it happened'. Ultimately that's what will transpire."

is this what happened the last time we talked, about the exhaust?

I linked a thread, take discussion of furnaces there.

You showed grit and tenacity when we went over the Operation Reinhardt killing method. There was still more ground we could have covered, but, after being shown I was wrong about the CO output (yup, I was wrong, I made more than one error and rolled with it, because of confirmation bias), I wasn't enamored with the idea of going over how to get uniform gas distribution, thing of that nature. Ultimately the CO could have been produced by the engine, so, the point was rather mute, and likely would have been dismissed. At least that seemed like the direction you were going.

Ultimately, my input about cremation would be to quote to you from these books or from people that work in crematoria. I'm not an expert in body disposal. For example, had I been given the task of destroying the bodies purported by the main stream narrative, I would have made them into a slurry with a mechanical separator, dried them on trays in the sun and then run them through a cremation oven. That's obviously not what the experts did.

So far as the killing operations are concerned, I would have flooded the half basement with the waste water a few hundred feet away and then pumped it back to the holding tanks, not messed with hydrogen cyanide. I'd have kept it simple and less risky. I also would have had a conveyor belt for taking a couple thousand bodies to the crematoria. Of course, there would have been a mechanical separator at the end of that belt, and I would have timed the belt speed as not to 'overfeed' the separator.

Again, that's not what the experts did.

They used a rickety clap trap piece of wood on a string to move 1 or 2 bodies at a time up to the crematoria from the corpse cellars.