AI Insights on the 'Holocaust'

[Stubble]

I beg your pardon?

I don't need a degree to notice that there are control samples with higher cyanid levels than the 'homicidal gas chamber' samples.

I don't care what 'spin' you try to put on that.

Taken with the removal of iron blues from testing, this makes the work by green and others highly suspect.

Personally, my opinion is that this is proof of a fraud to propagate the lie of homicidal gassings. I lack the credentials to prove it. Rudolf has the credibility in spades.

Bingo. Nessie failed to realise* that both Dr Green and Rudolf address their writings** to a general audience. This caused me to wonder to myself has he ever read the exchanges, and concluded that he had not, but I kept that to myself (until just now) because I don't like asserting things about people that I cannot prove. Anyway, both Dr Green and Rudolf are effective communicators, and they explain the underlying scientific basis of their arguments very well. Any failure to understand their teachings rests firmly with the recipient. He also seems to conflate "I don't understand X" with "I cannot comment authoritatively on X". I have no idea what the latter means, but it's probably irrelevant (like most of his slop) since the majority of us here simply seek to understand, not write articles for peer-review on the chemistry involved.

*Note - I think he realised this too late, after cementing himself into the "science is above our heads, lets all shut up and trust the eyewitnesses" shtick, and the backpedalling started once it was shown to him that most readers of modest comprehension understand these concepts just fine.

**Note - Rudolf isolates his technical workings to "excursus" chapters of his books to not impede (or bore) a generalist, while inviting a specialist to do as they please. Dr Green has also written a report for the attention of the Lipstadt trial, which is again aimed at non-specialists by nature, and Rudolf has co-authored one formal technical paper with Nicholas Kollerstrom (who IS a PhD, also).

It's actually interesting that Rudolf's technical paper doesn't seem to be discussed much so I'll post the archived link here:

https://archive.ph/9vFu3

Pertinent information from the paper;

The reason given by the Polish scientists to exclude long-term-stable iron cyanide compounds from their analysis deserves a brief discussion. If valid, a completely different approach to the issues at hand would be required.

Without considering possible pathways for the formation of long-term-stable iron cyanides in wall materials exposed to HCN, the Polish team assumed that maybe “the delousing room[s] were coated with this [Iron Blue] dye as a paint.”[12] Their supposition was based on a paper by Austrian chemist Josef Bailer, published in a political brochure by the Austrian government. [13] In order to exclude this pigmentation from the analysis, they decided to apply a method that was insensitive to iron cyanides.

It is worth emphasizing that a few published reports exist where a single fumigation of old churches with Zyklon B (or its successor product) resulted in exactly the same spotty blue plaster discoloration as observed here, caused by the formation of Iron Blue.

Iron Blue is not well-suited for wall paint, as it is unstable in an alkaline environment, and because fresh wall plasters saturated with Ca(OH)2 may have pH values as high as 13,[14] which decreases only slowly with time. Studies on the stability of Iron Blue have determined that the pigment is still stable at a pH value of 9 to 10. [15] Experiments conducted by Rudolf have established a stability limit of pH 10-11 for fresh Iron Blue precipitations. Beyond this value, Fe(OH)3 precipitates, leaving the re-dissolved hexacyanoferrate(II) ions behind, thus reversibly destroying the pigment. In their product information sheets for Iron Blue pigments, the German chemical company Degussa describes Iron Blue’s “lime fastness” – a measure of stability on fresh wall plasters – as “not good.”[16] 

Of note, I may have been misusing cyanid as I use it to describe derivative compounds and as a plural (cyanids). Apparently my usage is archaic. I guess I'm supposed to just say cyanides, although, I find this less descriptive and see it as an avenue for confusion.

[Nessie]

I beg your pardon?

I don't need a degree to notice that there are control samples with higher cyanid levels than the 'homicidal gas chamber' samples.

I don't care what 'spin' you try to put on that.

Taken with the removal of iron blues from testing, this makes the work by green and others highly suspect.

Personally, my opinion is that this is proof of a fraud to propagate the lie of homicidal gassings. I lack the credentials to prove it. Rudolf has the credibility in spades.

Except that there are chemists who disagree with Rudolf's chemistry and he admits, in his report, that he may be wrong. For there to be scientific proof, there needs to be a consensus, with Rudolf's report peer reviewed and assessed, corroborated as being correct. Instead, it is all theoretical, with no testing to ensure his findings are correct.

The cope here from you is palpable.

The only way that could be found to try to refute Rudolf was to exclude iron blue cyanids. The most stable and longest lived of the cyanids.

If you wanted to refute Rudolf the task should be as simple as testing the return air channels for cyanids. That this has not yielded the preferred results speaks volumes.

Those ducts are red brick, high in iron, and iron blues should be there in abundance. That they are not speaks volumes.

Nobody, I repeat NOBODY, washed out the fucking air channels and whitewashed that shit, so, even if you buy in to that cope, 50 years after the fucking fact, which is just another of the 6,000,000 lies used to prop up the holocaust myth, you can't just fucking hand wave that shit away.

Parts of the vents recovered from the ruins of Krema II found traces of HCN.

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/holocau ... t1894.html

How could the inside of those ducts be reached in the ruins? Why would ducts, that are only opened when the ventilation system is switched on, and air is being forced through, mean they should be coated in cyanides?

Homicidal gassing stories are bullshit yarns by non neutral parties used to convict Germans of crimes that they did not commit and excuse the allies for dam busting, atomic bombing, and the cremation of innocent civilians. Dresden was a real fucking holocaust.

It would be easier to fake the Dresden bombing than the Holocaust. Using the same tactics of Holocaust deniers, Dresden can be denied. It was all faked, the witnesses lied, it never happened because of Jews.

[Nessie]

I beg your pardon?

I don't need a degree to notice that there are control samples with higher cyanid levels than the 'homicidal gas chamber' samples.

I don't care what 'spin' you try to put on that.

Taken with the removal of iron blues from testing, this makes the work by green and others highly suspect.

Personally, my opinion is that this is proof of a fraud to propagate the lie of homicidal gassings. I lack the credentials to prove it. Rudolf has the credibility in spades.

Bingo. Nessie failed to realise* that both Dr Green and Rudolf address their writings** to a general audience.

Experts addressing a general audience, does not therefore mean every one in the audience will follow or understand. You have repeatedly failed to address that point.

This caused me to wonder to myself has he ever read the exchanges, and concluded that he had not, but I kept that to myself (until just now) because I don't like asserting things about people that I cannot prove. Anyway, both Dr Green and Rudolf are effective communicators, and they explain the underlying scientific basis of their arguments very well. Any failure to understand their teachings rests firmly with the recipient. He also seems to conflate "I don't understand X" with "I cannot comment authoritatively on X". I have no idea what the latter means, but it's probably irrelevant (like most of his slop) since the majority of us here simply seek to understand, not write articles for peer-review on the chemistry involved.

Not fully understanding the chemistry, logically means it is not possible to authoritatively comment on it. You are an overconfident denier, who thinks you can authoritatively comment on all the different methods used to investigate the Holocaust. I see that happening all the time, in particular comment on witnesses and archaeology, comment that is clearly ignorant of the subject matter.

*Note - I think he realised this too late, after cementing himself into the "science is above our heads, lets all shut up and trust the eyewitnesses" shtick, and the backpedalling started once it was shown to him that most readers of modest comprehension understand these concepts just fine.

I have not back peddled. You were misrepresenting my argument and then I forced to you to change.

**Note - Rudolf isolates his technical workings to "excursus" chapters of his books to not impede (or bore) a generalist, while inviting a specialist to do as they please. Dr Green has also written a report for the attention of the Lipstadt trial, which is again aimed at non-specialists by nature, and Rudolf has co-authored one formal technical paper with Nicholas Kollerstrom (who IS a PhD, also).

It's actually interesting that Rudolf's technical paper doesn't seem to be discussed much so I'll post the archived link here:

https://archive.ph/9vFu3

That you admit to the need for versions that have been dumbed down, is evidence that the chemistry is beyond the layperson.

[Stubble]

Nessie, the ducts tested in the Krakow study of 1945 were round ducts. They didn't come from the krema.

They probably came from a delousing room.

The Krakow study merits a new thread, you should start one.

Furthermore, copy of memorandum you link doesn't even refer to duct but rather 'zinc plated vent closures'.

The Kremas used butterfly valves, not 'vent closures', zinc plated or otherwise.

[Nessie]

Nessie, the ducts tested in the Krakow study of 1945 were round ducts. They didn't come from the krema.

They probably came from a delousing room.

The Krakow study merits a new thread, you should start one.

Furthermore, copy of memorandum you link doesn't even refer to duct but rather 'zinc plated vent closures'.

The Kremas used butterfly valves, not 'vent closures', zinc plated or otherwise.

You know that how? If you can evidence exactly how the vents were constructed, how can you not evidence what the Leichenkellers were used for 1943-4?

[Stubble]

Nessie, the ducts tested in the Krakow study of 1945 were round ducts. They didn't come from the krema.

They probably came from a delousing room.

The Krakow study merits a new thread, you should start one.

Furthermore, copy of memorandum you link doesn't even refer to duct but rather 'zinc plated vent closures'.

The Kremas used butterfly valves, not 'vent closures', zinc plated or otherwise.

You know that how? If you can evidence exactly how the vents were constructed, how can you not evidence what the Leichenkellers were used for 1943-4?

The fresh air side was constructed as two trianglular ducts and the exhaust side used rebar for vents and used the bricks.

It is in the prints.

So far as what the LK were used for, corpse storage with a secondary function as an expedient air raid shelter.

This really should go in the pertinent threads. Start one for the Krakow study and use one of the other LK threads for the rest.

[Nessie]

Nessie, the ducts tested in the Krakow study of 1945 were round ducts. They didn't come from the krema.

They probably came from a delousing room.

The Krakow study merits a new thread, you should start one.

Furthermore, copy of memorandum you link doesn't even refer to duct but rather 'zinc plated vent closures'.

The Kremas used butterfly valves, not 'vent closures', zinc plated or otherwise.

You know that how? If you can evidence exactly how the vents were constructed, how can you not evidence what the Leichenkellers were used for 1943-4?

The fresh air side was constructed as two trianglular ducts and the exhaust side used rebar for vents and used the bricks.

It is in the prints.

So far as what the LK were used for, corpse storage with a secondary function as an expedient air raid shelter.

This really should go in the pertinent threads. Start one for the Krakow study and use one of the other LK threads for the rest.

Do you agree that the revisionists who say the Leichenkellers were used as delousing chambers, mass showers and purpose built air raid shelters are wrong?

The evidence that they were used to store corpses, is some documents about sending corpses to the Kremas from around the camp. You do not have any documents about storing corpses in the Leichenkeller, or witnesses to that happening. As for the traces of the use of Zyklon B, how do they fit with the storage of corpses? Do other corpse stores have similar levels of HCN? Do you agree that makes your claim poorly evidenced?

The evidence that they were used to shelter during an air raid, is down to one witness describing that happening. That same witness also describes sheltering in the gas chamber and mass gassings taking place. Do you not think that is very poor evidence that the Leichenkellers were not used for mass gassings?

Your barely evidenced claims need to ignore 100% of the people who worked inside the Kremas, except for cherry-picking one small part of one witnesses testimony. You cannot explain the existence of heated undressing rooms, gas tight doors, barracks to store property, the secrecy and circumstantial evidence of mass arrivals and people sent to the Kremas disappearing.

Frankly, your level of investigation is incompetent.

[Nazgul]

You do not have any documents about storing corpses in the Leichenkeller, or witnesses to that happening.

Leichenkeller = morgue cellar. You called it that, so by definition contained corpses.

[Nessie]

You do not have any documents about storing corpses in the Leichenkeller, or witnesses to that happening.

Leichenkeller = morgue cellar. You called it that, so by definition contained corpses.

There are documents recording the construction of gas chambers in the Kremas, so by definition, there were gas chambers.

[Nazgul]

There are documents recording the construction of gas chambers in the Kremas, so by definition, there were gas chambers.

There were documents relating to the control of gases as all morgues have. Morgues are designed and equipped to manage gases that may be released from bodies, particularly during the process of decomposition. They employ various methods, including ventilation systems and specialized air purification technologies, to neutralize or remove these gases.

[Stubble]

You know that how? If you can evidence exactly how the vents were constructed, how can you not evidence what the Leichenkellers were used for 1943-4?

The fresh air side was constructed as two trianglular ducts and the exhaust side used rebar for vents and used the bricks.

It is in the prints.

So far as what the LK were used for, corpse storage with a secondary function as an expedient air raid shelter.

This really should go in the pertinent threads. Start one for the Krakow study and use one of the other LK threads for the rest.

Do you agree that the revisionists who say the Leichenkellers were used as delousing chambers, mass showers and purpose built air raid shelters are wrong?

The evidence that they were used to store corpses, is some documents about sending corpses to the Kremas from around the camp. You do not have any documents about storing corpses in the Leichenkeller, or witnesses to that happening. As for the traces of the use of Zyklon B, how do they fit with the storage of corpses? Do other corpse stores have similar levels of HCN? Do you agree that makes your claim poorly evidenced?

The evidence that they were used to shelter during an air raid, is down to one witness describing that happening. That same witness also describes sheltering in the gas chamber and mass gassings taking place. Do you not think that is very poor evidence that the Leichenkellers were not used for mass gassings?

Your barely evidenced claims need to ignore 100% of the people who worked inside the Kremas, except for cherry-picking one small part of one witnesses testimony. You cannot explain the existence of heated undressing rooms, gas tight doors, barracks to store property, the secrecy and circumstantial evidence of mass arrivals and people sent to the Kremas disappearing.

Frankly, your level of investigation is incompetent.

Nessie, I'm going to be very polite here.

Let's stop difting this thread.

Please kindly move conversation about the LK to an appropriate thread.

Your opinions about my personal rigor regarding the subject are quite welcome, but, none the less, simultaneously, quite wrong sir. That's something we can discuss, at length, in an appropriate thread.

I will again mention that the ventilation system is fucking backward for removing Hydrogen Cyanide Gas.

[Nessie]

The fresh air side was constructed as two trianglular ducts and the exhaust side used rebar for vents and used the bricks.

It is in the prints.

So far as what the LK were used for, corpse storage with a secondary function as an expedient air raid shelter.

This really should go in the pertinent threads. Start one for the Krakow study and use one of the other LK threads for the rest.

Do you agree that the revisionists who say the Leichenkellers were used as delousing chambers, mass showers and purpose built air raid shelters are wrong?

The evidence that they were used to store corpses, is some documents about sending corpses to the Kremas from around the camp. You do not have any documents about storing corpses in the Leichenkeller, or witnesses to that happening. As for the traces of the use of Zyklon B, how do they fit with the storage of corpses? Do other corpse stores have similar levels of HCN? Do you agree that makes your claim poorly evidenced?

The evidence that they were used to shelter during an air raid, is down to one witness describing that happening. That same witness also describes sheltering in the gas chamber and mass gassings taking place. Do you not think that is very poor evidence that the Leichenkellers were not used for mass gassings?

Your barely evidenced claims need to ignore 100% of the people who worked inside the Kremas, except for cherry-picking one small part of one witnesses testimony. You cannot explain the existence of heated undressing rooms, gas tight doors, barracks to store property, the secrecy and circumstantial evidence of mass arrivals and people sent to the Kremas disappearing.

Frankly, your level of investigation is incompetent.

Nessie, I'm going to be very polite here.

Let's stop difting this thread.

Please kindly move conversation about the LK to an appropriate thread.

This is a general thread and like many threads, it covers different topics.

Your opinions about my personal rigor regarding the subject are quite welcome, but, none the less, simultaneously, quite wrong sir. That's something we can discuss, at length, in an appropriate thread.

You are an incompetent investigator, and revisionist use of AI to investigate for them, has backfired. AI states the Holocaust happened.

I will again mention that the ventilation system is fucking backward for removing Hydrogen Cyanide Gas.

Not according to the Topf & Sons engineer who designed it. I believe him, since there is evidence to corroborate him that there were ventilated gas chambers inside the Kremas.

[Nazgul]

Not according to the Topf & Sons engineer who designed it. I believe him, since there is evidence to corroborate him that there were ventilated gas chambers inside the Kremas.

Morgues are designed and equipped to manage gases that may be released from bodies, particularly during the process of decomposition. They employ various methods, including ventilation systems and specialized air purification technologies, to neutralize or remove these gases. AI

[Stubble]

Do you agree that the revisionists who say the Leichenkellers were used as delousing chambers, mass showers and purpose built air raid shelters are wrong?

The evidence that they were used to store corpses, is some documents about sending corpses to the Kremas from around the camp. You do not have any documents about storing corpses in the Leichenkeller, or witnesses to that happening. As for the traces of the use of Zyklon B, how do they fit with the storage of corpses? Do other corpse stores have similar levels of HCN? Do you agree that makes your claim poorly evidenced?

The evidence that they were used to shelter during an air raid, is down to one witness describing that happening. That same witness also describes sheltering in the gas chamber and mass gassings taking place. Do you not think that is very poor evidence that the Leichenkellers were not used for mass gassings?

Your barely evidenced claims need to ignore 100% of the people who worked inside the Kremas, except for cherry-picking one small part of one witnesses testimony. You cannot explain the existence of heated undressing rooms, gas tight doors, barracks to store property, the secrecy and circumstantial evidence of mass arrivals and people sent to the Kremas disappearing.

Frankly, your level of investigation is incompetent.

Nessie, I'm going to be very polite here.

Let's stop difting this thread.

Please kindly move conversation about the LK to an appropriate thread.

This is a general thread and like many threads, it covers different topics.

Your opinions about my personal rigor regarding the subject are quite welcome, but, none the less, simultaneously, quite wrong sir. That's something we can discuss, at length, in an appropriate thread.

You are an incompetent investigator, and revisionist use of AI to investigate for them, has backfired. AI states the Holocaust happened.

I will again mention that the ventilation system is fucking backward for removing Hydrogen Cyanide Gas.

Not according to the Topf & Sons engineer who designed it. I believe him, since there is evidence to corroborate him that there were ventilated gas chambers inside the Kremas.

Oh yea? Well, your mother's got a penis!



In all seriousness, take talk about the LK to the appropriate thread Nessie, and, let's try not to just insult one another. I'm not shitting on you in this thread. Stop with the rage bait.

[Nessie]

....

In all seriousness, take talk about the LK to the appropriate thread Nessie, and, let's try not to just insult one another. I'm not shitting on you in this thread. Stop with the rage bait.

This is about revisionist use of AI to try and bolster their conspiracy claims. What took place inside the Leichenkellers is crucial to what happened, the alleged conspiracy and genuine history.

I take it that you accept AI is of no help to revisionism, as it agrees with the historians, that there were mass gassing inside the Leichenkellers.