"Direct" witnesses to gassings at Auschwitz Birkenau

[Stubble]

Howdy. Nessie has challenged me to prove that these 114 people are lying.

https://www.skepticforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=32920

I humbly request your assistance in this matter, as going through each testimony and debunking it is a tall order for 1 person.

Personally, it is my opinion that only a handful of these testimonies can be considered legitimate witnesses to the alleged operation (right place, right time to have seen something). People like Irine Zisblatt I do not even consider.

I started with Muller and will import that comment to this thread in the future. I haven't been through the rest of the list.

Thank you for your time, your assistance would be a blessing.

I'm surprised this exercise has not already been undertaken and completed.

[curioussoul]

They've all been dealt with in countless books, but I'm partial to Carlo Mattogno, so I'm going to suggest you read the following books which deal with most of the witnesses in your list. Broadly speaking, the direct gas chamber witnesses can be grouped into three categories: (1) witnesses who claimed to have worked in the Sonderkommando and was interviewed by Soviet investigators on location at Auschwitz immediately after the war, (2) ditto, but interviewed by the British/Americans after they were evacuated from Auschwitz by the Germans (!), and (3) random crazy witnesses who came forward after the immediate postwar period and claimed to have witnessed gassings personally (incidental witnesses or as supposed Sonderkommando members).

What all of these witnesses have in common, categorically, every single one of them, is that none of their stories are coherent or compatible with the orthodox reconstruction of gassings at Auschwitz. They all tell either absurd, verifiable lies, or repeat common Soviet propaganda. Not a single eyewitness told a story that is in any way wholly logical, historically accurate or compatible with what modern mainstream historians say happened in the camp. It's easy to challenge Holocaust affirmationists to mention their favorite or most important witness, and then show them how these witnesses consistently told the most ridiculous lies. So for orthodox historians to use these witnesses, they cherry pick individual statements from some witness testimonies and then attempt to reconstruct a believable version of events, mostly ignoring the rank, role or status of these witnesses. That's obviously the very opposite of how the historical method is supposed to work.

As Callafangers has pointed out in many of his posts, one of the key strategies employed by exterminationists is to flood you with names, documents, quotes and dates, with the aim of overwhelming you with a supposed mountain of evidence, ignoring the fact that every single eyewitness has already been analyzed and debunked by revisionist scholars for decades.

https://holocausthandbooks.com/book/the ... witz-myth/
https://holocausthandbooks.com/book/son ... schwitz-i/
https://holocausthandbooks.com/book/son ... chwitz-ii/
https://holocausthandbooks.com/book/son ... hwitz-iii/

[Stubble]

Nessie wants me to impeach the witnesses myself though, and I'd like a hand.

Milton Buki, among other things, victims of cyanide gas standing erect dead, and blue in color.

(Pro tip, the dead would be bright cherry red)

[Stubble]

Ya'akov Silberberg

The infirmed were not worth using gas on, so they were thrown alive into burning pits.

Are these the pits from Elie Wiesel's 'Night'? I suppose we will find them near the cracked open earth oozing black goo and rivers of blood in the aerial reconnaissance photographs, eh?

[Numar Patru]

Nessie wants me to impeach the witnesses myself though, and I'd like a hand.

Milton Buki, among other things, victims of cyanide gas standing erect dead, and blue in color.

(Pro tip, the dead would be bright cherry red)

Not at Auschwitz. Carbon monoxide poisoning causes cherry red coloring. Hydrogen cyanide would not.

[fireofice]

Not at Auschwitz. Carbon monoxide poisoning causes cherry red coloring. Hydrogen cyanide would not.

False. HCN and CO poisoning both cause cherry red skin coloring.

https://holocaustencyclopedia.com/toxin ... anide/363/

[Stubble]

Nessie wants me to impeach the witnesses myself though, and I'd like a hand.

Milton Buki, among other things, victims of cyanide gas standing erect dead, and blue in color.

(Pro tip, the dead would be bright cherry red)

Not at Auschwitz. Carbon monoxide poisoning causes cherry red coloring. Hydrogen cyanide would not.

https://search.brave.com/search?q=hydro ... 2cde8e4270

The cherry-red skin coloration is a reliable indicator of HCN exposure, particularly in cases where other symptoms are absent or nonspecific. It is essential to recognize this sign, as it can aid in timely diagnosis and treatment of hydrogen cyanide poisoning.

(Check my search terms in the box, use any other search engine you like, I've been using brave lately because it seems slightly less futzed with)

[Archie]

If you ask me, Nessie has no right to demand that you do a point-by-point response to a long list of witness names. He's sending you on a wild goose chase. Nessie didn't even compile that list. He plagiarized it from some other poster. So then this is Nessie's usual thing where he does zero work whatsoever and wants to make us do work. Screw that. He himself has not read most of those testimonies.

1) It's just a list of names. There is not one syllable of testimony quoted. No summary. Improper citations. Zero analysis.

2) Many of these witnesses have been addressed at length. Witness #1 in the list, Hoess, has an entire dedicated Holocaust Handbooks volume. More obscure ones obviously won't have received as much attention.

3) Many of them are very late (1960s) and are likely to be influenced by established narratives.

4) Imo, it is not necessary to "debunk" every single one of these. If an account is very brief and lacks detail (e.g., suppose the witness just says "I saw the gas chamber with my own eyes" and nothing else) then there isn't much to challenge/debunk. But it's also not very convincing. Ideally, we would be able to cross-examine all of these witnesses. Proper, critical cross-examinations were never done because, as a rule, all testimonies were collected by people convinced of the gas chamber legends. It is not especially hard to come up with a story that sounds somewhat plausible at a glance (funny enough, most of them fail even to do this). But it is hard to anticipate what questions a critical interviewer might ask and to come up with consistent answers on the fly. We saw with Rudolf Vrba at the Zundel trial what happens when these people are subjected to rigorous cross-examination.

5) Challenge Nessie to pick a few of the testimonies that he feels are the strongest. And then have him present, in detail, why those select testimonies are convincing. Why not start with #1 Hoess? If you go through 4 or 5 of his best witnesses and Nessie loses on those, then his bluff will have been called.

If you really want to compile something comprehensive, I would do it as a project on the wiki site. Maybe have a few general pages listing witnesses for a given camp and then have separate articles for the most important ones.

The Holocaust Encyclopedia has a lot of entries on witnesses. That's another resource.

[Stubble]

Thanks bud, reading this it makes a lot of sense. It also looks like nessie won't accept the information anyhow.

The wiki is probably a better place to put this list together.

I still want to invest some time in cataloging the ridiculousness.

I'll put it on my to do list.

[Hektor]

Thanks bud, reading this it makes a lot of sense. It also looks like nessie won't accept the information anyhow.

The wiki is probably a better place to put this list together.

I still want to invest some time in cataloging the ridiculousness.

I'll put it on my to do list.

An overview one should be able to get from the witness list of the Frankfurt Auschwitz Trial. Most of the testimony is well documented... And one should have a look how many claim to have actually seen homicidal gassing and to how many their 'knowledge' was only gossip....

[Stubble]

I'd link it, but, the disclaimer from the Dutch Government gives me some pause.

https://portal.ehri-project.eu/units/il-002798-tr_9

Note the disclaimer. I decided to link it as it should post with the disclaimer.